Mr. Job Mr. Chairman, I rise with
much pleasure to move a vote of thanks to His
Excellency the Governor for his
very fine opening address yesterday to the National
Convention, a momentous occasion in the history of
our beloved country.
We are now passing a landmark which I sincerely hope and believe will be the commencement
of a period in which the people of all classes
and denominations in Newfoundland will make
a new start. Where this journey will end no one
can at the moment forecast, but at any rate it
would seem likely to eventuate at some not far
distant date in an encouragement to every individual of voting age to take a much
wider and
deeper interest than they have done in the past in
the management of their country's affairs.
I am not going to review our past errors of
omission and commission at this juncture; but it
will be necessary during our deliberations to refer
September 1946 NATIONAL CONVENTION 5
to errors of the past in order to learn from them,
and I most earnestly hope that in doing so we will
all, myself included, be able to make our
criticisms constructive and helpful, and that we
will not waste our time merely in venting or airing
grievances with destructive criticisms. We will
all have to weigh very carefully the possible
effect of our words before uttering them, especially in the heat of debate.
I believe that we have a great and glorious
opportunity of showing not only to the people of
Newfoundland who have elected us, but to the
whole British Commonwealth, those of our
neighbouring Dominion and the United States,
upon all of whom we are so greatly dependent for
our future welfare, that we are capable of discussing in a frank but dignified and
friendly spirit the
somewhat involved problems of our future status.
Let us not forget, however, that true as it is that
we are largely dependent upon others, and particularly upon the United Kingdom, Canada
and
the United States, for our future welfare, it has
been clearly demonstrated during the past
strenuous six years that the many millions of
people in these great countries are to a considerable extent dependent for their protection
upon
the territory of our island, our Labrador territory,
and our resources. This fact alone should assure
us of sympathetic interest from the people of all
these countries in our endeavours to maintain a
decent standard of living here, under as independent an administration as this Convention
and
our electors may eventually decide to be the best
for our circumstances. These neighbours all have
an interest in seeing a happy and contented
people here, and will not forget that the Atlantic
Charter was solemnly negotiated in Newfoundland waters. Do what we will, our future
prosperity is dependent upon our economic relations, especially our customs tariffs
with the
mother country, Canada and the United States,
and upon our co-operation with all three of these
great nations. I regard this as the most important
sentence in my address.
The wide scope of our duties is shown by the
opening paragraph of our National Convention
Act,
[1] which reads as follows:
Whereas it has been decided that
provision should be made for enabling the
people of Newfoundland to examine the future of the Island and express their considered views as to suitable forms of government
for the Island, having regard to the
financial and economic conditions prevailing
therein, and that this provision could most
appropriately be the holding of an elected
National Convention of Newfoundlanders.
Some of us have come here with more or less
fixed ideas as to our future form of government,
but the majority of the delegates will agree. that
however rigid these ideas may be in some minds,
it is our duty to be ready to modify or change them
in accordance with the weight of evidence which
will be produced as the result of our investigations and deliberations.
I feel sure that unless this National Convention is conducted (as I hope and believe
it will be)
in an open-minded way, and that unless we grasp
this opportunity of showing to those who have
elected us that we are capable of that "quiet calm
deliberation which disentangles every knot", we
will not be able to convince the electorate of this
country, or of any other country, that we are
qualified to revert in the immediate or even the
distant future to the management of our own
affairs. I think that most of us will probably agree
that the goal at which every true Newfoundlander
must eventually aim is self-government in some
form or another, with or without restrictions, but
whether the time for this has yet arrived, is a
matter upon which no one should venture a
definite opinion until there has been an exhaustive investigation into our current
position.
I think that the electorate might justifiably
reject any recommendations this Convention
may make for self-government, or any other form
of government, if we fail to discuss our future
problems in a thoroughly searching manner. Unless we can furnish an intelligent, well-reasoned
report, there would be very poor hope that these
recommendations would be adopted upon submission to the electorate. An intelligent
well
reasoned report cannot be made without an exhaustive debate upon the pros and cons
of any
changes favoured, after first securing every particle of information we can gather
to shed light
upon our future economic position. There will no
doubt be some expert advice offered to us. We
should give such advice very careful consideration, but will have to use our own judgment
as to
6 NATIONAL CONVENTION September 1946
whether the advice is sound as applied to our own
particular problems.
Careful compliance by members with
whatever rules of procedure may be adopted and
utmost respect for the Chair and the rulings of our
distinguished and experienced Chairman, will
help create a pleasant atmosphere inside the Convention chamber and gain respect and
confidence
outside of it.
There is in my opinion one regrettable feature
about the composition of this National Convention, and that is that our returned service
men,
especially of the younger generation, are not
represented in a desirable proportion. The same
remark may apply to the women of Newfoundland, both those who have served abroad
and those who have worked so hard for the common good at home, during the past six
years.
I suggest that this defect might be partially
remedied by our inviting or requesting the
GWVA
[1] and indeed any other large association
not adequately represented in this Convention,
including one of the ladies organisations, such as
the Jubilee Guilds,
[2] to submit their considered
views in writing, or to send a deputation to present
them during the session of the Convention.
I feel quite incompetent to express in adequate
terms our good fortune in being able to welcome
His Excellency Sir Gordon Macdonald,
KCMG, in his position as the representative of
His Majesty and also as Chairman of the Commission of Government to open the proceedings
of this Convention During the few months in
which he has resided with us, His Excellency has
displayed such amazing energy and such charming tact that he has already endeared
himself to
our people of all classes. His delightfully sympathetic radio addresses, and more
especially his
personal contacts with the people residing in the
very large number of places which he has visited,
have definitely reached our hearts. It augues well
for the future of this country that we have at this
critical time as the nominal chief executive of our
little Dominion (or should I say ancient. colony)
one who has already shown such deep and intelligent interest in our problems, and
one who has
travelled already thousands of miles over our
country, underby no means luxurious conditions,
to see for himself the surroundings and especially
the standards of living of our most important
primary producers, namely, our fishermen,
woodsmen, miners and farmers. His Excellency
can rest assured that thanks to his fine addresses
and evident sincerity, he has impressed the
people of the capital as much as those of the
outports, and can count on their full support.
During the period in which the government by
Commission in its present form continues to
exist, I think we will most of us be happy to feel
that the Chairman of the Commission is one who
has wide experience in the management of public
affairs, and is one who has shown the qualities of
a statesman. With all due respect to the other
members of the Commission of Government, we
may perhaps be permitted to hope that His
Excellency's influence during the continuation
of the government in its present form will he
more than merely nominal.
The wise words and sound advice of His Excellency the Governor are on record and speak
eloquently for themselves and need no comment
from me; therefore Mr. Chairman, I now have the
honour to move:
That the chairman of this National Convention be requested to appoint a select committee
to draft in suitable form two
resolutions, one of which will be to the effect
that the members of this National Convention, elected by the people of Newfoundland,
desire to place on record, as their first act, an
expression of sincere loyalty to His Most
Gracious Majesty King George VI; and the
other resolution to the effect that the Convention wishes to express its sincere thanks
to
His Excellency the Governor, Sir Gordon
Macdonald, K.C.M.G., for his inspiring and
forceful address on opening the proceedings
of this National Convention.
Mr. Harrington Mr. Chairman and
members of the National Convention, it is with no
little awareness of the momentous significance of
this assembly that I rise to second the motion made
by the Hon. Mr. Job, that an address of loyalty be
presented. to His Majesty the King, and an address of thanks be presented to His
Excellency the Governor in reply to the gracious
speech with which he has been pleased to inaugurate
the sessions of the National Convention; and that a
September 1946
NATIONAL CONVENTION
7 select committee be appointed to
draft such address in reply.
In supporting the motion I cannot but help
make note of the fitness of the previous speaker
for this occasion in view of the epoch-making
nature of this unique constitutional assembly. For
history is being made today as well as yesterday,
and Mr. Job is very much a part of that history.
He is one of the few living members of the former
Legislative Council, which in this very building
less than a score of years ago made laws for
Newfoundland and Newfoundlanders. Furthermore, two or three years past, when comment
on
our confused status was frequent, Mr. Job in
communications to the daily press suggested a
body somewhat similar to the present National
Convention to discuss our affairs; and it must be
a source of pride and satisfaction to him now to
realise that his suggestions undoubtedly had
some, if not considerable bearing on subsequent
developments Finally, Mr. Job comes from a
family long associated with the life of this
country in all its phases and aspects; he himself
speaks with the wisdom of many years of the
same experience and the sincerity of his words on
this occasion cannot be questioned.
For myself, I speak as a young man relatively
unexperienced and untried in politics and government, but willing to learn and eager
to serve to
the best of my ability the land in which I was born.
My family too has had long associations with
Newfoundland. Their part may have been less
spectacular, but nonetheless heroic. They were
the good fishermen and farmers, tradesmen and
sailors, the good wives and the good mothers.
They worked hard for what they got; they loved
this land for the work it gave them, and the
freedom which in time they won because of their
work and their zeal. The family antecedents of
each man here fall into one of these two groups.
Now the wheel has come full circle and we are
here to serve their memory.
The Governor's speech, as indeed was expected, fully lives up to the forthright, energetic
and sincere individual whom we have met and
heard in recent months. Being appointed to his
responsible position at such a critical time, he has
made every effort to acquaint himself first-hand
with the country and the people, and not even
Mercury, the winged messenger of mythology,
could have travelled as fast and so far in the
interests of a better understanding, than Sir Gordon has since his arrival. He has
spoken of the
honour and the responsibility that is ours, and the
great opportunity we have for selfless patriotism.
And he has refreshed our memories concerning
the ancient glories of this, the people's house, and
the honourable giants of men who in the past
rendered noble service in the cause of their
fatherland. In truth, I may say, as many other
Newfoundlanders are saying, we are glad that Sir
Gordon Macdonald, "a man's man", is amongst
us at this hour.
A moment ago I said history is being made
today. It prompts me to wonder if men who make
history truly realise it at the time. I doubt if they
do for such a realisation is almost enough to
unman them. Still, whether we realise it or not,
history is being made and it will continue to be
made when this Convention has been disbanded
and dispersed; and our names are on the records
of history, for good or ill, and for the inspiration
or dismay of those who come after us.
Newfoundlanders have lived under many administrations and many forms of constitutional
assemblies, but search as we may, we can find no
precedent for the present body of which we are
members. Yet that fact which may have been a
concern to some of us, need not be a deterrent;
for even the most conservative man will admit
there must be a first time for everything. Inasmuch as a man, according to Warburg,
"cannot
be a conservative until he has something to lose,"
I might say, perhaps, that a man cannot be other
things until he has something to gain. And I say,
let no man in this house be swayed by the thought
of what he may lose or gain at this most critical
juncture of our history.
There are older men here with a first-hand
knowledge of days that are past, and young men
like myself, whose knowledge for the most part
is confined to what we have read and heard. There
are men here who have been in government, and
men who hope to be in it in the future. There are
men here who cleave to certain ideas and turn
away from other beliefs, and Walter Lippman
remarks that "Men are much more likely to see
the truth in that which they love than in that which
they hate." Therefore there is need for calmness
and unprejudice; for patience and tolerance.
What we need to bring to this Convention, more
than an open mind, is a fair mind that will respect
8 NATIONAL CONVENTION September 1946
each and every man's opinion, whatever our own
beliefs or determination.
Let every man too, be fearless and outspoken,
within the bounds of the agreed rules of procedure, and with due respect for the Chair.
Let no
man be awed by the glib and prolix amongst us;
each of us has his convictions and it is imperative
that we express ourselves. Let us do so with
directness, remembering at all times to preserve
the dignity of this assembly in the face of the
country and the outside world.
No government in this country has ever undertaken so grave a responsibility as that
which
weighs on this assembly: to recommend a constitution or constitutions for the choice
of the
people of Newfoundland. We are told that the
people want this or that, when in truth what the
people want, simply, is a guarantee — a guarantee of good government and a guarantee
that
capable and honest men will not be lacking for
the conduct of affairs. Given that guarantee, the
present indecision about self-government will be
swept away.
Too much time is devoted to talking about the
problem of Newfoundland and not enough energy applied to finding a solution. The prophets
of
gloom assert we are eternally on the edge of an
abyss; that nothing can be done; that we have no
future — as though no other country ever had a
problem. What is this fantastic problem of Newfoundland? We speak the same language;
we
enjoy religious freedom; we have no persecuted
minorities; we do not want to make war on
anybody to gain more living space. In this
modern day our fishery resources are virtually
untapped; we have forests; we have minerals; we
are a hard-working and good-living people.
Where then is the problem? It is nothing more or
less than ourselves; we will not trust ourselves to
ourselves and so we trust ourselves to others.
That is not a problem — it is a state of mind that
only mutual trust and a belief in our own integrity
can overcome.
Part of that state of mind is our readiness to
take the line of least resistance. It is so much
easier to assume that nothing can be done than to
actually try to accomplish some end. It brings to
mind the phrase of an anonymous writer: "The
reason some men do not succeed is because their
wishbone is where their backbone ought to be."
Is that part of our problem? Do we spend too
much time wishing for something to happen instead of working to make things happen?
Is that
why we feel we cannot run our country, because
we haven't the backbone, and so we turn it over
to others who have the backbone, but unfortunately for us have not the same ends in
view? I
think that the root of our problem is spiritual; not
in the religious sense, but in the sense that means
enthusiastic, mettlesome, animated with a belief
and a flaming desire to make Newfoundland a
better home, and Newfoundlanders a name to
conjure with among all men. We are still a
pioneer country, and we need the pioneer spirit,
unafraid to blaze new trails, cross new frontiers,
and look ahead to far horizons of achievement.
In closing my remarks in connection with the
seconding of the motion proposed by the
Hon. Mr. Job, I address a special word to the
people of Newfoundland, by whose faith in us we
are here. Your responsibility did not end with the
elections in June, for the most important vote you
will ever make will be cast on the recommendations of this Convention in a future
referendum.
You must keep informed, and we will see to it
that you are kept informed by radio and
newspaper so that you will be enabled when the
time comes to make the right decision. And in
urging you to follow the proceedings of the Convention with all your attention, standing
here in
this chamber peopled with the ghosts of many
public-spirited men, I warn you that no system
can guarantee self-govemment to a people too
indolent, too ignorant or too indifferent to cherish
and fight for its own freedom.
It is in this spirit, Mr. Chairman and members
of the National Convention, that I second the
motion made by the Hon. Mr. Job that an address
of loyalty be presented to His Majesty the King
and an address of thanks be presented to His
Excellency the Governor from this Convention.
Mr. Chairman Does any other member
wish to speak to the motion? If not, is the
Convention ready for the question?
It has been proposed by Mr. Job and seconded
by Mr. Harrington that the Chairman of this National Convention be requested to appoint
a
select committee to draft in suitable form two
resolutions, one of which will be to the effect that
the members of this National Convention, elected
by the people of Newfoundland, desire to place
on record, as their first act, an expression of
September 1946 NATIONAL CONVENTION 9
sincere loyalty to His Most Gracious Majesty
King George VI, and the other resolution to the
effect that the Convention wishes to express its
sincere thanks to His Excellency the Governor,
Sir Gordon Macdonald, K.C.M.G., for his inspiring and forceful address on opening
the proceedings of this National Convention.
[The motion carried unanimously]
The committee on the address of loyalty to His
Majesty the King and of thanks to His Excellency
the Governor will be:
Hon. Mr. Job, Mr. Harrington,
Mr. Ballam, Mr. Crununey,
Mr. Hickman, Mr. Fowler,
Mr. Fogwill, Mr. Newell,
Mr. Cranford, Mr. Jones,
Mr. Dawe, Mr. Keough,
Mr. Penney, Mr. Goodridge.
I would suggest that Hon. Mr. Job might be
the convenor of this committee. As I said to you
yesterday, I submit for your consideration the
necessity of the immediate appointment of a
committee on rules and procedure. I need not
stress the special importance and necessity of
this. I suggest that the committee be immediately
appointed to take up this all important matter.
Mr. Brown I have much pleasure in
moving that the committee be appointed from the
Chair.
Mr. Chairman Proposed by Mr. Brown
and seconded by Mr. Figary, that the appointment of
a committee on rules of procedure be in the hands
of the Chairman.
[The motion carried unanimously]
Mr. Brown, Mr. Butt,
Mr. Figary, Mr. Higgins,
Mr. Bradley, Mr. Smallwood,
Mr. Crosbie, Mr. Fudge,
Mr. Ashbourne, Mr. Hollett
Mr. Starkes, Mr. Miller,
Mr. Job, Mr. Cashin
I suggest that committee meet with all possible dispatch, and that while awaiting
the report
the rules of the House of Assembly, as we once
knew them, should apply as far as possible to
these proceedings of the Convention. When the
committee has completed its task and made its
report and you have accepted it, these rules will
supplant the old rules. Perhaps one of you will
propose and second the application of those rules
to the Convention whilst awaiting the report of
the committee.
Mr. Bradley In the interim, and while
awaiting the report of the committee, I quite agree
with you that we cannot do better than adopt the
regulations and rules of our House
of Assembly. You are very familiar with these and
they might form a basis for our draft of rules to be
submitted to this house.
Mr. Chairman Is the house ready for
the question? It is proposed by Mr.
Bradley and seconded by Mr. Brown that pending the
report of the Committee on Rules and Procedure and
the adoption of that report, that the
rules of the House of Assembly
mutatis mutandis
should apply to this Convention.
[The motion carried unanimously]
Mr. Chairman There is no further
business- at least, on the agenda. But if any member
wishes to speak, he may do so.
Mr. Smallwood On the matter of
seeking and obtaining information from the
government that the Convention may find necessary,
would individual members have the right to
submit questions or requests for
particular information? And such requests having
been made, would they be deemed to be going to the
party concerned as from an individual, or would they
be vetted by the Convention and then come to the
government as a whole? And should they be directed
to the government as a whole, or to individual
department heads or commissioners?
On these questions I am very vague in the
absence of rules governing them; but I imagine that
a great amount of information will be sought from
the government. No doubt, the procedure for doing
so will be laid down in the rules, which may take
two or three weeks and in the meantime many
members may have questions on which they desire
authentic information. I do not know whether members
will submit questions verbally or write them and
hand them in.
Mr. Chairman I see no objection to
following the rules of the House of Assembly. I may
say that all questions were submitted in writing.
Each member has the right to give notice of a
question.
10
NATIONAL CONVENTION
September 1946 For example, Mr.
Smallwood asks the Commissioner for
Education to table certain reports. Having given
notice the question will be passed to the Secretary.
Then as in the old days, it will be required that
the Speaker find whether the question is relevant.
In the meantime I see no objection to any member
saying that on tomorrow he will pass to
the secretariat a question, and the question in turn
will be passed to the department
concerned. I do not see how the members can get
information in any other way.
Mr. Smallwood You have not made it clear as to whether
questions asked by an individual member go to the
government automatically, or whether they go from the
whole House and must be adopted by the House.
Mr. Chairman I thought I made it clear that by passing them
to the Secretary they will then be passed to the
department concerned.
[Mr. Smallwood then read a series of questions
concerning Gander airport]
Mr. Hollett It appears to me that if we are going about
this inquiry into the state of affairs of our
country, and if we are to be delayed by each
member's asking any question as might occur to
him overnight, we are not tackling the matter in
the best systematic manner. We have a factual
statement of affairs in the Amulree Report
[1] up to 1934. Our
business is to find out how things stand now; what
has happened between 1934 and the present time, and
whether or not we are financially and
economically sound or self-supporting. If we are to
tackle it in the proper manner, we ought to take it
subjectively: take finance, deal with it and be done
with it; take fisheries, deal with each matter under
its own heading. I referred to the Amulree Report. I
think that report is pretty near correct. We ought to
deal with one department of Newfoundland affairs at
one time and be done with it. What makes me speak of
this is that I saw a communication in the press where
one of the delegates had received a letter from the
Governor's private secretary relative to the
departure of the Commissioner of Finance.
[2] It was thought that
the commissioner ought not to be leaving at this
particular juncture. We had the assurance given us
that the Commissioner for Finance would be here for
two weeks. Therefore, we ought to tackle the problem
of finance first.
Mr. Hillier The object is to inquire
into the future forms of government.
Mr. Fogwill After listening to the two previous speakers, I
am of the opinion that there has not been enough
provision made, and it would now appear that the best
thing would be to appoint a special committee to
draft a plan of action....
Mr. Chairman I had in mind, subject to the wishes of the
Convention, a steering committee, that would have the
setting out of the rotation of business and plan of
campaign. If my suggestion is agreeable, the
committee will meet with all possible dispatch....
Mr. Bradley It is not, I take it, intended to limit the
right to ask a question.
Mr. Chairman In the old days we had the order paper, and
the order paper was the daily agenda. We will have to
have the same method to enable us to know what is
going to be discussed and by whom.
Mr. Brown As perhaps the oldest member of this House, I
might say that I do not see how we can progress
without some line of procedure. I move that this
house will adjourn until such time as the Committee
on Rules and Procedure has drafted a plan and it is
adopted, so that the House can be guided by that line
of procedure in the right way.
Mr. Cashin I am inclined to agree with Mr. Hollett. One of
the commissioners is leaving Newfoundland; he holds a
most important position in the government
in regard to finance. Whilst I agree with Mr. Brown
that without certain rules we cannot
proceed, I feel we should take advantage of the
commissioner's presence and direct financial
questions to him. I would suggest that these
questions be put on the order paper and that Mr. Wild
come here and be further able to answer questions
that are not quite clear. You will remember, Mr.
Chairman, what happened in the old days. A
member placed questions on the paper
directed to the finance department and the next day
the department tabled the information; and if the
inquisitor wanted any further information, the
minister was there and he got up and said "I want to
know something else." The only way to get information
is to have the Commissioner of Finance here and
whoever wants to ask a question, the Commissioner is here to answer it.
September 1946 NATIONAL CONVENTION 11
Mr. Chairman In the old days the
asking of questions was not the time for debate. The
answers could not be debated, but any explanation necessary could be made; then
further questions asked if the answer was
not clear.
Mr. Job I take it the idea of the
Chair is that this committee should deal with the
question of a programme. In view of the great
importance of this finance matter, I suggest that
this committee meet tomorrow and that the first item
would be the question of finance, and that would
enable us to meet and go ahead with that question.
The setting up of a programme, as stated by Mr.
Fogwill, is very important
indeed....
Mr. Chairman It is evidently
desirable to take these matters up.
Mr. Smallwood I agree that it is
desirable to plan a programme. I agree also with
Major Cashin in what he said regarding the presence
of the Commissioner for Finance. But why wait for
the Committee on Rules and Procedure? Decide
now. If we are to get information from the finance
department, then that is that.
Mr. Crummey Does it come within the
rules to draft the agenda?
Mr. Chairman We can give the
committee special instructions, it does
not follow that they have to make the agenda.
Mr. Chairman Of course, but it requires some study... I
thought the committee might meet this afternoon if
they wish to expedite matters.
Mr. Crosbie I think the committee
should meet this afternoon. It seems to me we are
going to lose a great deal of time if we do not
invite the dif~ ferent heads of the departments
here. If we are going to send questions to the
departments they might be consigned to the waste
paper basket.
Mr. Smallwood The questions I have submitted are typical of
those that might be submitted and it would be a waste
of time to ask a commissioner to come up until he had
the question, and had replied in writing. When he has
produced the documents then he could be here for
supplementary questions arising out
of his answers. Not that I have any objection to
their being here, but there are times when it is much
more practical to write your question.
Mr. Chairman All that would come
within the purview of the committee.
Mr. Hollett Do we know what powers we
have
to summon anyone, whether it be a commissioner
or not? We should define our authority.
Mr. Chairman The Convention has no
power to compel attendance or to compel him to
answer questions. In the old days the statutory
rules did not cover this and they were amended in
1890 by laying down what is known as statutory
authority to subpoena witnesses and a committee
would take evidence on a particular point. This was
found not only desirable, but the only practical
method. The witness on a particular point would
attend before a select committee. They had
statutory authority and these witnesses were required to answer. I am not giving a
judicial opinion, of course. There is no express
authority in the Convention Act giving the
Convention power to subpoena witnesses.
Mr. MacDonald if we are going to
discuss matters, we must have evidence. If
we have no power, then our attendance seems useless.
If you would point out to us where we can get such
authority, it would be helpful.
Mr. Chairman I take it requests might
be made by the Convention for all necessary
information or for the attendance of witnesses.
Mr. Job It seems to me that it will
be time for that when we find they will not attend.
I think they will give us the information.
Mr. Jackman I understood that this
Convention would be a fact-finding board; now I hear
from you that whilst we are a fact-finding board, we
are that in name only.
Mr. Chairman I did not say that. I
pointed out to you, that my reading of the act did
not disclose the authority to compel attendance.
Mr. Jackman If we are going to find
our facts it is going to be necessary to have
outside opinions, and I would like to know if it is
possible for this Convention to protest to the
government, if necessary, the lack of having that
power, and the necessity on behalf of the electorate
of Newfoundland that we should have that
power.
Mr. Bradley I can quite understand
the desire of every member of this Convention to
have all available information and I am in accord
with that idea, but there is not the slightest
evidence that we are going to be refused any
information. We cannot enforce it, it is true; but I
do not see that there is anything to suggest that
any department of the government will not have the
slightest desire to refuse any legitimate
information. If we
12
NATIONAL CONVENTION
September 1946 should meet it,
then we have other methods of getting that
information.
Mr. MacDonald If the old House of
Assembly found it necessary to have special laws so
that they could call evidence, then there must have
been some reason for that.
Mr. Chairman The Convention has no
legislative power it is true, but
perhaps we might cross that bridge when we come to
it.
Mr. Bradley With your permission, I
would suggest that this power of a select committee
was in connection with private bills on which they
wanted evidence or private rights being interfered with.
Mr. Hollett I was not insinuating
that any department would refuse to
disclose facts; I was thinking more of the people
outside the departments to whom we may
have to go for necessary information relative to,
say, the fisheries. It would be a terrible insult to
our people if this body sent a request to John Jones
to give us some information and he said, "I will not
attend." I take it we could request the Commission
to consider a slight amendment giving the Convention
power to subpoena witnesses if we so desire. I would
rather have the necessary power to ask a person
to come here with the feeling we would not be
turned down.
Mr. Smallwood I do not want to
prolong this discussion, but this happens to be a
popularly elected body in Newfoundland, the first
elected body since 1932; His Excellency has conspicuously graced it and appealed
to
the public for support of it; also he has graciously
come and opened it and there exists all over the
country tremendous approval and sympathy with the
Convention, and the last thing on earth the Commission would dare to do is refuse
information that we must have. There is no
industrial concern, no commercial society which
would not be happy to come here or write us in
response to any request we make.... They dare not
refuse it. With all due respect, it is anticipating
a most unlikely thing to happen and if it does we
will know how to deal with it. There is a matter I
would like to mention in regard to the attendance of
visitors Would this be a matter for the committee -
could it be arranged through the issuance of tickets or through delegates, so that
anyone who wishes to attend a particular session may
do so? A member may have three or four constituents
who might wish to attend and they should not have
to stand outside and take a chance on getting in.
Mr. Chairman I think that can be arranged; but the general
question is how the proceedings are to be conducted.
There may be an occasion when you want to have a
private session; that is a matter for yourselves. I
think the committee will deal with the various
matters.
Mr. Jackman As a member of this
Convention I am not satisfied with the authority we
have. In regard to summoning, say, government witnesses, I do not think they would
refuse, but we may have to go to England yet. We may
have to go to Canada. If we are a fact finding
board, and suppose we want to bring back Sir John
Hope Simpson, or Sir Wilfrid Woods, we have no
authority whatever to summon them.
Mr. Chairman Usually a writ of
subpoena does not run outside the country. You have
the right to summon people only within your
jurisdiction.
Mr. Chairman Mr. Brown made a motion
that the Convention adjourn and that a committee
appointed draft rules and report back to the House
and that motion, was seconded by Mr. Crosbie.
Mr. Job It is indefinite. I wonder if we could adjourn
until, say, Monday; the committee might make an
interim report.
Mr. Brown I submit that there is no
committee going to hang up longer than necessary the
work of the Convention. I have no reason or desire
to delay the Convention or the work, but the committee cannot decide it in 24 hours.
It
will take time to discuss, deliberate and decide on
what line it will take.
Mr. Smallwood Have we not adopted the
rules of the House of Assembly? We have rules.
Mr. Job I do not think they could
possibly get through all the business of the
committee by Monday, but I thought they would get
enough done to enable the House to continue meeting
There is a lot of work for the committee to do. It
would give us dme to make a report on the progress.
Mr. Brown If you will pardon me, I take it for granted that
my honourable friend means that this committee will
continue in office during the life of the convention,
because after all there will be necessity for new
miles or lines of procedure to be made every week as
long as this Convention remains open.
September 1946 NATIONAL CONVENTION 13
Mr. Chairman There is one difficulty
that appears to me — difficulty of getting
in touch with the members and it would be better to
know now the date, then we would know exactly when
we were to re-assemble.
Mr. Hollett I fail to see how it can adjourn indefinitely. It may take some time for the commit
tee to draft the rules but we
should meet every day; we were not sent here for
indefinite adjournments. Another thing, I
do not think the public should be admitted where rules
and regulations are being made relative to the
business. I do agree that the committee should be
allowed time.
[The Convention adjourned until September 16]
