Monday, May 1.
On division, the motion was negatived.
The House, on motion of Mr. OTTY, took up the order of the day, and the discussion
on the Address in Reply.
FIFTH PARAGRAPH, AND MR. KERR'S
AMENDMENT RESUMED.
Mr. WETMORE.— I mentioned to the
House on Saturday, that I thought there
was nothing in the existing law on the
Statute Book to prevent the Government
taking action with regard to Railway Extension. On looking over the law, I cannot
find anything that would directly prevent them. But then there is no law to prevent
murder, but simply to punish those who commit that crime. Although there is nothing
in the law to prevent the Government from carrying on Railway extension, yet there
is such a thing as public faith, and if the late Government entered into any arrangement
with parties to engage in the work, the credit so pledged ought to be maintained.
On looking over the Facility Bill - sometimes called the Lobster Bill - I find in
the fourth section, a certain bonus is given to any company who, by conforming to
certain requirements, fulfil the terms of the act. Under this Bill, passed by the
last House, a company was formed in St. John, who obtained an act of Incorporation,
under the title of the European and North American Railway Western Extension Company.
The Legislature held out certain inducements which should accrue to parties complying
with certain acts. The company in St. John was formed, and a large amount of stock
secured, and before Declaration day in St. John, it was said that a gentleman - Mr.
Parks - had gone to England to get such stock taken up there as would enable the company
to carry on the work. There is no doubt, but that Mr. Parks has gone for that purpose,
and the talents and energy possessed by that gentleman leaves no room to suppose but
that everything will be done to accomplish the object of his mission. If an individual
makes a certain offer to another, and arranges to do certain things, if certain acts
are complied with, - if that individual fails to fulfil the engagements entered into,
there is a Court of Chancery through which the injured party can obtain redress for
his grievances, but when engagements are entered into with a Government, and they
fail to perform, there is no redress; there is nothing but the good faith of that
Government to rely on as a guarantee of the fulfillment of the promises made. I feel
assured that the present Government are embarrassed in their action by the engagements
entered into by the late Government, and that there are certain rights existing under
the acts on the Statute Book which prevents further legislation. I am glad that the
Government have, in as strong terms as they could, held out to the people of the country
the promise of Western Extension, as soon as circumstances will permit. If it was
not for existing laws, and engagements entered into under them, the want of means
to carry on the work would not have been as great a barrier as some seem to imagine.
My only regret is, that the Government could not proceed, but I am satisfied they
will do so as soon as possible, and, therefore, under these circumstances, shall vote
that the paragraph pass.
Mr. CONNELL.— The subject of Railways has been before this country for a long time. In 1837 the
first move was made, and from the time the first grant
from the casual revenue was made down
to the present, not a year has passed but the subject has been discussed in this House.
It is much to be regretted that the statement has been put forth here that the legislation
of the last Session is not intended to be amended by the present Government. I think
the country looks for this. I have always been in favor of measure which like these
tend to open up and improve the country. True, at the first there were great difficulties
about the St. John and Shediac Railway; but gradually these were overcome, and now
we have that road. Still, in consequence of having no connection at either end, it
is of little value to the country, as it involves a large expenditure of money without
any adequate return. It is satisfactory, however, to know that it is one of the best
constructed roads in British North America. But it is not my purpose to go into the
subject of that Railroad. I believe it is necessary for the prosperity of this country
that the Government take some immediate action with regard to the extension Westward.
I do not think the statement made by them in the paragraph under discussion is a very
correct one. I should like to ask the Government if they have made any effort to ascertain
the nature of the difficulties spoken of, and if they cannot be removed. I very much
doubt if any difficulties really exist to prevent further legislation in this matter.
Will the hon. member for St. John tell the House whether it is the intention of the
people of the County of St. John, who have taken up stock, to raise obstacles to the
carrying out of this work? Is not the course laid down meant rather to assist the
Government to get rid of the responsibility resting upon them, which, I admit, is
great? I believe the Treasury is nearly empty - then why do they speak of the improved
state of the finances of the country? I am surprised that the Government should have
laid the Speech of His Excellency on the table without propounding to the House the
policy they intend to pursue. I believe it is customary for the mover of the Address
to define the policy of the Government and the course they intend to pursue. I should
have been pleased to have heard the President of the Council state the policy and
course of the Government. He has not seen fit to do so; but they come and lay the
Speech before us, and the only statement they make in explanation of their intentions
is the introduction of a Bill for the abolition of the office of the Postmaster General.
I do not now intend to speak on that subject; but when it comes up I shall state to
the House the opinions I entertain as to the importance of that office to the commercial
and financial interests of the country. I would, however, ask if we are to go back
to the irresponsible mode of carrying on the public business which once existed here.
If this Address pass, the office of the Postmaster General goes back into the hands
of the parties who are totally irresponsible to the country; and I am prepared with
facts and figures to show that such a course would be most destructive to the postal
interests of the Province. It is an office second to no other. When I had the honor
to hold that office I performed the duties it involved, and carried into effect decisions
of the Council. I did not, however, on every little matter consult with them, nor
should I if I held such an office again, for I believe that it detracts from the furtherance
of the interests of public business. This is the only reform - but I call it de
12 DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1865.
struction—I see foreshadowed in reference
to this matter. If the Government intend to refer to the course to be pursued by
the heads of Departments, I hope they will inform the country,— which is looking to
the House that something may be done— that they will assume the country that something
will be done to stop the tide of emigration from this Province. Unless some steps are
taken by the development of resources of the country; unless public works are inaugurated
to improve the state of the country, young men will leave as fast as they can: and
I should like to have seen some assurance given that some measures would be introduced
for the good of this Province in this respect. It is said: Let them depend on their
own exertions; but when there is little or nothing on which their exertions can be
effectually expended, they will go away to places where they can do better. Look at
our Exports. The country once depended on its lumber, but now almost every move in
that direction entails a loss. I am sorry in looking over the Speech to see nothing
having reference to the mineral resources of the country. The time has come when
these, if properly fostered and encouraged by judicious legislation, would make a
vast improvement in the labour and industry of this Province. Look at the coal mines
of Albert and Queen's Counties; is anything being done to encourage the development
of their riches? When in the Government I was instrumental in producing a grant of
$2000 to develop our mineral resources, and I now consider it to be one of the first
and most important points to be looked after by a Government. Unfortunately many of
these mines are in the hands of individuals who cannot work them to advantage, (Hon.
Mr. Smith; " Would you take them out of their hands?") I would do something to encourage
monied men to come to the Province and buy them, even if they had to pay and exorbitant
price for them, rather than they should remain as they are. I know gentlemen at the
present time who are willing to go into the working up of the coal districts, but
what would be the use of spending five, ten or twenty thousand dollars without seeing
a chance for a return? I think the Government should take hold of this matter.
Again, there is a large quantity of
iron in the district in which I reside indeed there the most valuable iron is found
of any place in the Provinces. Where is
every facility for working it, plenty of
wood for firing, but what is the state of
things, what is the fact? Last year a
gentleman from England said to a gentleman interested in the working of the
mines and who was desirous of obtaining the assistance of capitalists, "Your iron
is without doubt very valuable, there is wood and every other requisite for the working,
but till we can ascertain by the action of the Colonies that they intend to provide
for the defences of the country it would not be safe to invest money in the work."
If we could have obtained Confederation there would have been no difficulty. I believe
that if the majority of the people were able to express their opinion on that question
to-day, they would decide its favour. The people in the section of the country where
I reside know the value that connection would have been. I have often invited the
President of the Council to go up and visit that part, and I now extend the invitation
to the Hon. Surveyor General. I hope he will come and see for himself the value of
the mineral resources we possess and
that the next Speech will have something
to say about it. We have the iron, we
have the wood and coal. and for three
months in the year we have water communication but for the other nine months
we no outlet for the productions of
the country. Lumber with us is nearly
run out, and it is to be hoped the people will now leave off a business not
good for the country and engage in
some operations that will prove more beneficial. At the first we had a company
at work, but their operations did not
prove successtul. Now the company are
working right. They have one furnace
and another partially completed, but unless they receive some assistance from the
Government by opening up communication it is doubtful if they will be long able
to continue on. The expense of carrying on the works is very large; wood
and coal can only be brought in at prices
that make the labor unremunerative.
This matter is most important.
Mr. CONNELL.—Yes, we want you to
build it now. The Government have not
shewn to the country that I have done
anything to remove the difficulties said to
exist, which precludes them from carrying
on Western Extension. It appears that
the only way in which they are at all
bound, is by the offer of Mr. Livesey to
build the line to the Nova Scotia boundary. But what does that amount to?
The offer was accepted on certain conditions, which have not yet been fulfilled.
It seems that somebody has been at work
in order to obtain the building of the line
from the Bend through the County of
Westmorland, and that that work is to go
on, whatever else is done. This arrangement however, has nothing to do with
Western Extension. I do not see that it
stands in the way at all. If it does, I
should like to see some paper from the
last Government; shewing that difficulties
really do exist. It is said with regard to
the company formed in St. John, that the
President, now in England, has written
back that nothing can be done there.
Mr. CONNELL.—I believe he would,
since it appears the company will not be
able to go on. The arrangement with
Mr. Livesey seems to be the only difficulty
in the way, if a difficulty really exist.
The railway in operation has been managed well, but the Government appear to
desire to be relieved from all responsibility with regard to extended works. Col.
Boyd is the only member now in the
House—Mr. Wilmot and I came in shortly after—who heard the first speech made
before this House by Sir. J. Harvey. He
said his Government would lead the way,
but it was for the Legislature to act.—
I am glad to see that the President of the
Council has changed his views on the
question of railways. He has a perfect
right to change his mind, and I hope he
will change it on the subject of Confederation. Whenever anything is said on
this question, the honorable member
looks over at me. It is said the Government was formed on the principle of Confederation.
If such be the case, Mr. Speaker, I appeal to you, whether a Government founded on
one question alone, without a reference to the general interests of the country, can
have the confidence of the people. The honorable member for Northumberland has said
that he could not support the present Government because of the conservative element
in it.
Mr. WILLISTON.—Mr. Speaker, I made
no such observation. I merely said, that
I could not support them in this matter.
I could not vote for this part of the speech.
Mr. CONNELL.—If the honorable member did not say so, I stand corrected, although I was of opinion
he did say it, but
no matter. So far as the Government is
concerned, it makes no difference to me
now, that I am speaking in reference to
their action with regard to their railway
policy, for if they will go to work and
carry out a good policy, I will support
them. Ithink that something like the
following, instead of the paragraph under
debate, would have been more satisfactory
to the people : " We will consider whether further facilities can be afforded for
the extension of Railways in this Province. We are pleased to learn that the
completion and extension of the European
and North American Railway, from the
frontier of Nova Scotia to the boundary
of the United States, will be undertaken
as soon as the necessary legislation can
be had thereon." I want the country to
understand, that this work will go on
when legislation can be had upon it.
But I wish to refer to the Speech generally. " We share with Your Excellency the
feelings of satisfaction at the prospect
of the speedy restoration of peace in the
neighboring Republic." Everybody must
rejoice at the speedy close of the war,
but still must deeply regret what has
taken place with regard to the death of
the President. I have been in that section of country, and seen the devastation
and destruction that have taken place
there. I have seen the battle fields and
the hospitals, and know the evils resulting from the civil war; and hon. members
who have not witnessed them, must all
regret the strife which has raged there.
On hearing the news of the death of the
President, I was very much struck with
surprise and regret, and was glad to see
the feelings of sympathy which was expressed. I had the pleasure of a personal
interview with the President. A kinder-
hearted man did not exist; his countenance showed it. His death is a loss to
the nation -a loss that must be felt to be
great at the present time. I am rejoiced
at the expressions of sorrow which has
pervaded the minds of all on this Continent on this subject. Every friend to
humanity must abhor the act of the murderer.
I next come to the Confederation business. I shall not make any remarks on
this further than to say, that when the resolution comes before the House, I shall
state my views on the subject. They are
known now in the country. I thought I
was correct in the judgment I formed of
the scheme, and I think so yet. We must
either provide for the defence of this
country or let it alone. It is the duty of
Government to see to the proper defence
of the Colony, or the had better let
legislation alone. If Confederation had
taken place, I would have voted for the
appropriating of such a sum as would be
suited for the purpose according to our
means. But until they adopt this policy I shall not vote away a shilling, except for
such small affairs as are absolutely indispensible. Look at the report of Col. Jervois.
He says that beyond Kingston it is futile to provide for the defence of Canada. On
this account I believe Confederation would have proved a benefit, so that we should
have had a means for defence, and further means which we could probably have obtained
from the British Government; but for us to attempt to provide for the defence alone
is futile. The
DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1865. 13
people of the United States do not want
nor desire a war with us, but the feeling
with regard to the Alabama and our
vessels is very strong. The President of the United States, in speaking to the Lord
Palmerston, remarked, that he was a great statesman, but wrong in the course he pursued
with regard to the Alabama. The people do not desire war; but they number their population
by millions, and soon there will e large bodies of men, who have acquired a military
ardor, out work, - these will be found going to Mexico and Canada.
Mr. CONNELL. — I express my honest
convictions that these men will leave the
States and go to Canada, Mexico, Cuba, and parts of South America. I am glad to see
that the Canadians are determined to se what the British Government is is going to
do. Some of the hon. members think the people here do not want connection with Canada,
and other that the connections was too speedy. I saw that throughout the [illegible]
the honorable President of the Council opposed it only on the grounds of the time.
(Mr. Smith - "O, no.") And we have the word of the hon. member for Kent that his first
object was to turn out the existing Government and then see what was to be done. (Mr.
DesBrisay - "I did not say that.") The matter with regard to the Militia Bill, the
Post Office, and the Union of the Colonies, will come up hereafter and be discussed,
I presume. I do not wish to take up the time, as this is to be a short Session. I
see the hon. member is going to speak and I hope he will show us some plan by which
the country can raise money without paying interest. I think something might be done
in this matter. The time has come when it is necessary to fix on some solid basis
for our Banking interests. I am sure the people would be benefitted if a different
state of things existed. In New York the people feel secure. The way they work in
Canada I have not looked into if this Railway goes on, some plan could be matured
by which the Province could issue notes which would be a legal tender for duties and
all other things. There are many other things I should like to have seen in the Speech,
but will not now go into them. In reference to the Railway, I hope the Government
will take immediate action on it. If it is not carried on great evils will fall upon
the country; young men and old men too, that can get away will leave. The people
want Railways, and it is just as well to have them at once. There is no source of
wealth so good for the Province.
Hon. MR. WILMOT — I thought the hon.
member for Carleton was gong to oppose the action of the present Government, but find
at the close he intends to support it, or that at least he will offer no factious
opposition to their measures. With regard to the clause of the Address under debate,
I think it already shows that the Government intend to proceed with the work as soon
as existing legislation admits. The hon. member for Northumberland say they are opposed
tothe prosecution of Western Extension as a Government work, but are willing it should
be carried on by a company. I think the Government should not have their hands tied
up by the passing of these amendments. I would ask the hon. member for Northumberland
if the question was on a road from Sherdiac to Chatham if they would oppose it as
a Government work, I rather think they would want it left open to be carried on as
would be found best. I
hope the hon. member will be induced to
withdraw his amendment, and give the Government a chance to go on with the public
business. The hon. member for Carleton wants the work to go on at once; but let the
Government have time. The hon. member, Mr. Boyd, and myself are the oldest members
of the House. When Railways were first mooted I moved a resolution which, if noted
on, would have prevented our being burdened with a heavy foreign debt. I thought then
that Treasury notes should have been issued, and I think so still. That was in 1849,
just after the great depression of 1847. Now we have experiences in constructing roads;
we have plenty of labor if we had the money to employ it; there is lumber to make
the sleepers, material and skilled mechanics to erect station- houses and all other
works. The only articles we really need to import is the iron rails to lay the track.
My object always has been to employ the labor of our own country, and I hope the time
will soon come when we shall be able to make our own rails. I have always been in
favour of progress and free trade; but while the made gold the basis for paying the
debt, it was important that the imports should exceed the exports, as otherwise it
would cause a panic and crisis. We have seen what has been done in the United States,
and the plans they have adopted to raise means to carry on their great undertakings.
The House will have to see in what way Railways can best be provided for. I heard
in St. John that there were a million dollars lying in the Bank at three per cent
interest. If we had an issue of Province notes as in Prince Edward Island we could
raise money to carry on our public works as the House well knows. The revenue last
year was $1,080,000. I shall not, however, go into figures, but I hope the House will
give the Government a chance to do something. They do not intend to be a do nothing
government, nor to enter upon works which will embarrass and distress the Province.
All they ask is to be allowed time to mature their plans and carry out a policy which
shall be for the welfare of the country.
Mr. SUTTON — When I was elected to a seat in this House, I was not pledged to the support of
any Government, neither was I sent to support Confederation, for Confederation was
dead before the election took place, but I was returned pledged to oppose this measure.
Few as the public woks are which this Government have introduced, they have introduced
one too many for me. I have had the pleasure to shake hands with the President of
the United States, although I deplore the commission of a crime, the result of which
has filled all hearts with sorrow. But with regard to this question. Last year the
people of the North paid $2,300 to the support of the Railway from St. John to Shediac.
This line is of very little advantage to them and I think it would be an act of injustice
to them to make them pay a further sum to push the extension to the Western frontier.
If the people of Saint John have confidence that the Railway will be of so much benefit
to them, - and they will get the benefit if any body does - let them take stock in
the company and assist in building it. There are four Counties in the North that would
receive little or no benefit from this extension. Why did not the Government foreshadow
the construction of a line to the North? If this had been done, we might have had
machinery at work and care building in Chatham. I remember the promise of an
honorable member for York, that we should have rail for rail, spade for spade, sleeper
for sleeper but it does not seem to be the intention of Government to pursue that
plan. We have had experience in the building of Railways and the honorable member
for Saint John must know that the cost of construction would be much greater to the
Government than it would be to a company like that formed. The roads and bridges are
in a bad state, and require heavy expenses to put them in a good condition. The roads
from Chatham to Richibucto is said to be so bad that it is almost impossible to get
along. I have worked for years, side by side, with some of the members of the present
Government and know their ability, but on this point I cannot give them my support,
If my honorable friend and colleague saw the injury that will be done to the people
of the North by this measure, he would not stay in any Government who determined to
carry on the work.
MR. NEEDHAM — I wish the hon. member for Charleton were in his place to hear my remarks. With
regard to the hon. member for Northumberland's remarks, there are always two sides
to a story. Believing, and knowing as I did, that Western Extension included a line
to Chatham, I did make the remark that I would go for their having rail for rail.
But, as Western Extension was the basis of the whole thing, as he is opposed to our
end of the line, of course I am absolved from my remark - This is an important measure,
but beore coming to it, I wish to follow the example of other hon. members who have
spoken on the Speech, and introduced a good many things outside of it. No man having
any regard for humanity, or the principles of right and wring, can do otherwise than
endorse the expressions of the Speech and Reply, respecting the death of the President
of the United States. It is not often the case in the present day that the head of
a nation falls by the hand of an assassin, and the effect of this blow will be felt
not only by every manly heart on this continent, but by those on the other side of
the Atlantic. It is well known that from the time of the firing of the first gun at
Sumter to the present, my sympathies have been in favour of the North. But with regard
to Railways, and I am glad the hon. member for Carleton is now in his seat, I do not
quite understand the position he takes. He is surely not willing to take the right
of building Railways given to companies, by existing acts, from them, for this principle
if extended would deprive the people of Queen's from the right to the coal mines,
and deprive Carleton of their iron. Any man who would pursue such a course, and take
Stock away from any company, ought not to be permitted to stand on the floors of this
House. I am opposed to the building of Railways by companies, as I think is should
be Government work. Still rights granted to companies must be maintained, but if the
conditions are not complied with, then I believe the work should be carried on by
Government and with a due regard to the interests of the different parts of the Province.
The hon. member for St. John has fully explained the principle of the private rights
of individuals, and how the law slips to restrain any infractions of those rights.
I cannot go for this amendment. There was a time when I was on the floor of the House
with the hon. members for Carleton and the remark of his to-day, brings back to the
remembrance of old times. It was when he said, "Something must be done." I have not
heard it since the time we were
14 DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1865.
on the floors together before, and then I
spoke of his laying sacrilegious hands on King's College. When he made the remark
that something must be done, it put me in mind of a story (which I related to the
House) of three boys. They were named respectively, Charles, James and John. These
boys were out in the fields together when a heavy rain storm came on, and they took
refuge under a tree. Whilst standing there the tree was struck by lightning and overturned,
the roots tearing up the ground all round, and got the boys into a bad scrape. Charles
turns round to James and asks, "Can you pray?" "No." "John can you pray?" "No." "Well,
by hokey something must be done." The honorable member says, that the Government was
formed on the principle of Federation, then why does he look for any measures from
them. But I always thought this Government was formed on
Anti-Confederation principles. If they are not, they can't have my support. Confederation
was not dead when I was elected, but it received its death blow at my election.
(Laughter.) I am glad that reference is made to this subject in the Speech, and that
the report of the delegates is to be laid on the table. I hope when it is brought
in and laid there, no hand will be raised to disturb its everlasting repose. Reference
has been made to the remarks made by hon. members in their canvas, and on the hustings;
I think this unnecessary, as as almost any man is the best of a political contest,
will say something or other that he can't sustain afterward. That scheme was replete
with financial destruction, and political ruin to this country. When I heard that
$2.75 was put forth as the probable tax per capita, I said that manner of arriving
as it was not honest - it was a political trick. It was made up on the whole population.
Now, the 250,000 inhabitants of this country don't pay taxes, but only, about 71,000,
and if the rate were made up in this way, it would give some $12.90 per head The
city of Fredericton is taxed some $10,000 a year; the population is 6,000. Now, I
know very well that if you divide the ten by six you get one and something over, but
$1 and something over is not the tax the people pay. No, that would be on men, women,
children, and babies, and they don't do anything towards the avenue that I know of,
unless they do in Carleton.
Mr. NEEDHAM - Yes, when they've got
them. My honorable friend, Mr. Connell says that three-fourths of this people are
in favor of Confederation. I tell him it is not the case. It is the opinion that there
are not three quarters of Carleton, nor a half, nor a third, in its favor.
Mr. NEEDHAM - Because I believe what the people tell me; I believe if the subject were submitted
to the County, the ballot boxes set up every few miles, and the people provided with
ballots - Confederation - No Confederation - the result would be that not one-third
of this country would be in favor of it. It was a scheme connected in Canada to suit
their own locality. They may have been educated, as it was stated, by desires for
fair dealing with us, but what honesty is there in saying, if you give us all your
revenue be it what may, we will give you $250,000 out of it for yourself as long as
you live. The good old Judge Marshall of Nova Scotia has shown that in fifty years
this arrangement would have swamped the whole of us. What would
have become of us if the scheme had been carried. Where would we have got the fifteen
members to go in the general government? Who among us could compete with the members
up in Canada. In forty years our revenue would have been $4,000,000, and we should
have got some $201,000 for our own use whilst the balance would have gone to them.
No man is worth the name of a statesman who legislates merely for to-day. He should
look into and provide for the future, for if he don't live for ever, somebody else
will. I have said the scheme possessed the germs of political destruction, and so
it does. The only link that now binds us to the mother country is the appointment
of His Excellency as our Governor. Judge Halliburton may say in England that the people
of New Brunswick are disloyal, but who believes it? I wish I had Sam Slick here. This
link that binds us to England was to have been broken and our Governor was to be appointed,
and sent down from that place up there is
Shogermoc. (A member - "Ottawa,") Yes Ottawa. The cat was then let out of the bag, but there
was not a white hair on it, not even on the tip of her tail. They talk about my being
noticed in the papers, well that's good: for you know that's an honor anyway (laughter.)
The delegates went to Prince Edward Island and met. Now I hold that notwithstanding
His Ex cellency by the advice of the Governor General, appointed delegates to meet
other delegates, yet he had no right to sanction their acts. The Canadians were just
ar ranging for a Union of Upper and Lower Canada, and hearing of the proposed Legislative
Union down here, came down, broke up our Convention, and got themselves all re-appointed
to meet again in Canada. Now this was right enough as long as they only met to deliberate,
but they had no right to draw up a protocol, such as they did. When they got back
here they found it necessary to go round the country and stir up the people. It put
me in ind of one of Aesop's fables. A certain animal, called a monkey went out on
a little travelling expedition, (I don't know whether he went to Quebec or not) but
one thing is certain, but some means or other he got back without a very important
appendage. Of course the other monkeys came round to see such a strange sight, and
so to get them all into the same fix as himself, he told them that was the fashion
where he came from, and advised them to follow his example. It was just so with the
delegates. They went to Quebec, lost their tails, and on coming back want us all to
cut off ours. The hon. member for Carleton County says if the young men are going
away; so they are here. Some time ago there were some seven or eight who started off
to join the war because they thought they could make more by going than by staying
here. That's right enough. It is the case everywhere, but that is not a good place
to live in. People take the notion of going away from a place. I know a whole lot
who went off to Salt Lake, to the Mormons. Did the country suffer by that? No, because
it saved us the trouble of putting them in a lunatic asylum, and the expense of supporting
them there. The honorable member says he knows all about the Post Office. There is
no doubt of it. He says he did things without consulting with his colleagues in the
Government, and I believe him. The honorable member now asks the Hon. Surveyor General
to make a visit up to his part of the country. Well if he can't go, there is one thing
he can do, get himself
photographed and send his picture Perhaps that would do as well? Now I am not in the
Government, I haven't been and I don't intend to be - till the time comes. But this
principle laid down by the honorable member for Carleton of doing things without the
consent of his colleagues is anew one to me. Since the creation of the office of Post
Master General there has been an annual defi ciency of about $20,000.
Mr. NEEDHAM - It never amounted to that sum before. I believe the Post Office department was
conducted just as well under the old regime as now.
THE DEBATE ON THE FIFTH PARAGRAPH RESUMED
MR. NEEDHAM - I agreed with the hon. member for Carleton in his remarks on the President of
the United States; but when he came down to the question of defence, I thought he
would have used some sound argument on the subject. I think some other plan than that
pursued should have been adopted by the Opposition, but with regard to defence, I
am of opinion that if this country were able to spend even ten times the amount of
the revenues of this Province and of Canada, it would all amount to nothing if we
were assailed. The repent of Col/ Jervois perfectly shows this. With regard to our
natural defence - the Militia - when the question comes up I shall express my opinions
upon it. I will now say, that if we had a lot of officers well drilled, provided with
clothing, guns, and ammunition, it would be better than turning out the whole of the
Province, to forget in three hours what they have learned in three days. If a plan
of this kind could be arranged, I think that in connection with the volunteer movement
and the regular army, it would prove effective; but I believe our best defense is
not to talk so much about war. As to war between Great Britain and the United States,
we have only to turn to the papers to see the ministers in the British Parliament
declaring that the two Governments never stood on a better footing than at present,
that should differences arise they could only be settled by arbitration and diplomacy.We
may beat them at that, but we could not by putting the country in a state of defence.
I do not want my words to be understood as conveying an idea that we would quietly
sit down and submit to invasion. Not at all. I am sure if the time came, the country
would rise and join heart and hand to resist the spoiler of our hearths and homes.
(A MEMBER - "We could lick them.") It is all very well to talk about licking, but
when the lick comes, perhaps it would be found best to let licking alone. I agree
with my honorable friend that the lumbering interests are becoming useless. I have
made up my mind to one thing, and
15
That is, that this giving to great lumbering
men the right to cut out some 20, 30 or
40 miles of timber land shoul be be abolished. The plan I think should be adopted
of selling by the thousand.
I agree in what has been said as to our
Mines and Minerals. I believe that either
I or the Government, before the Session
closes, will show that we have faith in these resources by employing a competent gentleman
to make a thorough geological survey of the Province, and see what we really have
here.
All I have to say is, that if the Government will carry out Railway Extension according
to the law, either by themselves or by engagements with companies, they shall receive
my support. The people must and will have Western Extension. The Government are new
men, filling new offices, and I am willing to give them a chance. I believe they should
have at least three or four days to feel the honors laid upon them. But afterwards,
if they do not inaugurate a policy of extended works, then they must know that there
are people in this country and House who will do so. I say this to show the Government
that I am willing to aid them in carrying out Western Extension.
Another thing, I am willing to go the
whole hog to show the British Government that we are sincere, and that we do
not want to sever the connection existing between us, or annex ourselves to the States,
(for I do not believe this feeling resides in the breast of one man). I want them
to know that the reason we rejected the Scheme was because we love the connection
with our mother country, and that the very men who voted against, are willing, if
necessary, to shed every drop of their blood in defence of her cause and institutions.
Mr. McMILLAN. - The member for York
has made a long Speech with very little
touching the matter under discussion. I
am not finding fault with the Government for not carrying on Western Extension, for
I believe the revenues of the country are in too low a state to admit of it; and are
not only so now, but will be for years to come in too feeble a state to carry on the
work of the main trunk without taking into consideration the branches. The expense
of this work alone will entail a burden of $260,000 a year upon the country. But I
do find fault because they assign reasons for not carrying on the work that do not
in reality existe. The Company with which arrangements were made have not fulfilled
the conditions of that engagement. Before they can claim anything from this Province,
they have to show that they have fulfilled the conditions; that they have provided
sufficient funds, and that they really intend to go on with the work by commencing
to build a portion of the line. Before the statement made with regard to them can
be sustained, they have to do certain things which as yet are undone. But supposing
that they had done all that was required of them, was not this law on the Statute
Book a year ago? Did not the hon. member for St. John know of this law when he made
the statement on the hustings that the work must be carried on at once as a Government
measure? Since that time no engagements have been entered into which would prevent
the road from being carried on. I belive the position taken by the Government sufficient
in itself to kill the company in Saint John. We find by the hon. member fo the government,
the hon. member for Northumberland, that it is not the intention of the Government
to proceed with the work, whilst
the President of the Council says it will
be preceeded with. (Hon. Mr. Smith
" No, No.") I would call the attention of
the hon. member for St. John (Mr. Anglin) to an article in the
Freeman under the signature of A. I (and for which, whoever writes, he holds himself responsible,)
in which, after reference to the clause of the address under debate, he says that
he "hopes the existing legislation will not prevent the Government from going on with
the work. " - Now I want to know how the intend to carry it on. There is another point.
As I understand the answer to the Speech, it is intended to foreshadow the action
of the Government not in the future, not a year or two hence, but ath the present
time. The Answer now under debate, however, does not seem to claim this for its object
this Session. I believe the financial condition of country for years to come will
not admit of the Government carrying on the work. The cost of the main trunk to the
country, without the branches, will amount to $268,000 a year, and if the branches
are built to the sum of $390,000. I am not in a position therefore to vote for the
Government to carry on this work, and I hope the hon. member for Northumberland in
the Government will not do his constituents the great injustice of laying this burden
upon them. If they want the road to be built, why not assist the company by still
further facilities without undertaking the whole work as a Government measure. I am
in favor of the Amendment.
Mr. WETMORE said in his Speech he
had reffered to the Act to build extension
Westward and to the Facility Bill. He
wished just to call the attention of the House to the 13th Section of the Bill which
provides that companies, to entitle them to any claims allowed by the Act, must commence
to build the road within two years. He merely wished to show up honorable members
that if any company complied with conditions within that time they would be in a position
to make a claim for the grant.
Hon. Mr. ANGLIN. - I have not spoken
as yet, as I thought I would let honorable
members have an opportunity to express their opinions, so that I might know what ground
to take. I was surpised at the opening attack by the hon. member on my left (Mr. Gilbert).
Many of the members seemed much hurt by his remarks, but I considered that he paid
the highest tribute he could have done to the Government, for he saw that the Government
ought to have done in forty-eight hours from its formation what would take and ordinary
one seven years to work out. He must have believed the members of the Government to
be men of unparalelled ability, if he imagined they could have even treated upon all
the subjects he mentioned. The hon. member for Restigouche has given the same speech
which I have heard before - the same cuckoo cry - that he was not opposed to the Government,
but the finances of the country would not admit of further Railway Extension. I think
the words of the speech are definite. It distinctly states that the work will be proceeded
with as soon as practicable, Oh but it is said, one member of the Government -who
was not then a member of any Government - said on the hustings, that he would not
belong to a Government that would act at once proceed with the work. It is not expected
that he can drag along seven or eight other men with him to prosecute his ideas, without
time for them to mature their plans. What that member said, he repeats, that when
the Govern
ment fails to carry out plans which he
thinks are for the benefit of the country, he will no longer remain a member of that
Government. Oh, but the finances are low. Yes, but what did a then honorable member
say on platforms in St. John about this Western Extension. He said that first there
was the $10,000 a mile - an out an out gift, the the amount of Stock subscribed, then
the stock taken by the City of $400,000, and if sufficient could not be raised after
this, he was willing to guarantee to provide the balance of the cost at six per cent.
This proposition was put forth by those who now are so fearful of burdening the revenues.
We are not here to judge the late Government. This Government, however, distinctly
state their policy. They says existing legislation precludes us from taking action
ona anything that would infringe on the rights of the people. The opposition say there
is nothing in the way - this is admitting that there was nothing in the legislation
- that it meant nothing. I have said, and I says again, that it was all a sham. It
was my impression at the time that no company would be formed, but Iwas mistaken;
a company has been formed; still I freely state that I don't believe they will ever
do anything - that they will ever turn the first sod. They have raised funds, however,
and their President has gone home. It is true we could repeal the act, but we would
not do so whilst there was a semblance of infringement of rights guaranteed to any
one by the Act. I am responsible for what I said on the hustings, and prepared to
stand by it. The state of the finances has nothing to do with this question. Railroads
in their construction do not take money from the revenues. Is it raised by loan and
if it entailed the levying of further taxes, they would be cheerfully paid in Saint
John. But we have a strong belief that it will entail no burden on the country at
all. If the city take the Stock of $400,000 they agreed to, taxes there will be increased
about one third. I should have to pay about $12 more than I now pay, and some would
have to pay $500 more. I say this to show the strong faith the people have in the
feasibility and paying qualities of the road. Works of this kindought to be carried
on by the Government. I find the objections raised to this work more contradictory
than the speech. Some want the work to go on, others don't want it at all, while member
fo the late Government want it to go on, and yet not to go on. I think the section
ought to pass.
Mr. GILBERT. - I did not rise to defend
the late Government at all. I rose thinking this Government did not require to
take so long to define their policy. I
was born in this country. I may say this
great country, with capabilities to maintain a large population, who could put out
all their energies and yet not exhaust its resources. I thought that it was not necessary
the Government should take long to shew the policy they intended to follow. I thought
the men who composed that Government, possessed as they are of great minds and large
abilities, could go on with the great public works, and define their position even
thought they had not been in existence twenty-four hours. I rose, not to oppose the
Government, but as the representatives of a large and influential consituency - not
to defend the late Government, for I was opposed to its do-nothing policy. But wishing
to warn the new Government that "something ought to be done," that the sound of the
pick and the hammer might be heard in the land; that great works might be car
16 DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1865.
ried on, and that connection with Nova
Scotia should be commenced and pushed through to completion. Not knowing
what hindrances were in the way, was I to
stop? I thought they had had time enough
to deliberate on what was wanted by a
small country like this, with a population
of less than 300,000. I told them I intended to support them if they brought in
measures I could approve. I came here
perfectly free and independent, I came here
not as a partizan of any set of men. I
came here pledged against Confederation, no farther am I pledged, and I propounded
the same ideas to my constituents on the hustings as I did here. After the statement
made by the President of the Council, that obstacles stood in the way of carrying
on the work of the main line, I learned that there had been a distinct offer made
to carry on the work to completion. I do not intend to oppose the Government, but
am I to be catechized because, when the speech was going by without discussions, and
the mover of the address gave no statement of the policy of the Government, I rose
to express my opinions on public works.
Hon. Mr. SMITH - I do not quite understand the object of the hon. member's
lashing himself into such an immense
fury. The hon. member is not bound so
far as I know, certainly not to me, for I
was not in the Government at the time of the elections. He is only pledged on the
question of Confederation. I do not complain of the course pursued by my hon. colleague.
I only expressed my disappointment and surprise at the course which he saw proper
to pursue, a course that must surprise our constituents as much as it did me. The
Government had not been in existence twenty-four hours, when the hon. member stood
up and said that the indications were bad, and complained that we had not brought
in any great scheme for the colonization of the country. As I said, he is not responsible
to me, but to his constituents. It has gone forth to the country that he is in the
Opposition, still I don't complain of his action, but I tell him as I would any other
hon. member that I was surprised and disappointed at the course he saw fit to pursue.
And now it is said that no difficulties really exist to prevent the carrying out of
this railway work, I put it to the late Surveyor General, if Mr. Parks did not go
to England under pledges of the late Government. And under these circumstances, we
should be recreant to every principle of justice, if we proceeded with the work. I
ask the hon. member, if he were a member of a Government, whether he would not feel
bound by such action. He is please that the Government do not intend to carry on the
work, yet his late leader was willing to guarantee the balance of the cost of Western
Extension. Mr. Tilley is by all acknowledged to be a cautious man, and would not make
such a pledge unless he intended to carry it out. The hon. member cannot deny this
- his mouth is shut on this point. I want to put it to this House whether they are
willing the Government should act in violation of the good faith of the late Government,
and that the pledges made by them should be broken, in order to carry this work at
once.
Mr. McClellan. - Do I understand
that the Government would go on with the work if no legislation stood in the way?
Mr. CONNELL. - In case the company
surrender their charter has the Government any right to go on with the work?
Hon. Mr. SMITH. - It is not usual to
ask questions of this kind until the address has passes, and I shall certainly decline
to answer.
Mr. CONNELL. - But this may have a
material bearing on the vote of the House.
Mr. McMILLAN. - In reply to the questtion of the President of the Council I would say, that if
the late Government had not been prepared to meet the legislature on the question
they would not have met them, but if the had intended to carry on a certain work they
would have foreshadowed it in the Speech. I would direct the attention of Hon. Mr.
Anglin to the promise of the late Provincial Secretary which he states was to provide
for the building of the road Westward if sufficient Stock was not taken up to complete
the work.
Hon. Mr. ANGLIN. - What I said was
that the Facility Bill provided a grant of $10,000 a mile & there was a large amount
of Stock subscribed, the city had agreed to take $40,000 worth of Stock and then Mr.
Tilley promised to provide all the rest at six per cent.
Mr. McMILLAN. - What I understood
by the statement of Mr. Tilley was this, that as a member of the Government he would
take the responsibility of guaranteeing the balance over a million dollars, taking
security on the whole of the road.
Mr. WETMORE. - Being a new member and rather green, I may be pardoned if I state my opinion on
this matter. I apprehend that if the Government want to pass an Act for the prosecution
of the work, they will apply to the House to do so after existing legislation can
be surmounted. I understand Government intend to carry on Western Extension and therefore
I shall support the passage of this paragraph. I think there are independent men enough
in the country to look after public works, and carry them on with economy, and that
they could get more out of it than any individual company could do. But of course
if influences are brought to bear upon them, and they begin to give two prices to
one contractor, and three to another, the public money will be wasted. I do not expect
anything of this kind from the present Government, for from the high standing they
hold - although there is rather too much conservative element in it - I judge in their
hands the finances are safe.
Mr. LINDSAY. - I am disappointed in reading the Speech that the Government are not going on with
the work. The President of the Council says he is not responsible for the statements
that go forth, and other members of the Government say they are not responsible.
Mr. LINDSAY. - Yes and the hon. member said more than that. He said also that he was not a member
of the Government when he made certain statements, and consequently is not responsible
as such. Mr. Tilley said that he would guarantee, after all the Stock of the Company
was paid up, and the whole sums received, to build the balance of the road, taking
the road as security. Now - (A member "Don't go into that.") Very well, other members
have talked aside from the question ; however, I wish to say a word or two. An honorable
member this morning referred to a remark of mine which he got second hand. He said
I had made a remark on Saturday that "he would explode". I did not say so and I think
, after the effort of this mornning there is no danger of his exploding to night.
He further referred to remarks
made to Mr. Goodspeed. I said that the statement he put forth that every man, woman,
and child would be taxed $8 a head was not true. It appears to me that honorable members
have been wandering back in their Speeches to other paragraphs. The members of the
present governement used to cry to the late Government, bring down your measures ;
now they find fault because of the expressions used on the absence of - line of policy
they intend to pursue.
Mr. McMILLAN. - I would not like to take the position of the honorable member for Northumberland
that his feelings were with the conservative element in the Government, nor would
I like to take an opposite one, but I think that gentlemen in the Government should
be thankful to Confederation, that by it they have arrived at positions they would
not otherwise have had. Flushed with victory their exposition of Confederation is
worth little. I believe that half the votes in the country are in its favour. I am
opposed to the passage of the paragraphs in the address, as it seems to complain of
certain things which have arisen under existing legislation - which they declare to
be a sham and a delusion. I do not suppose that the Government after the surrender
of any rights any company may have thought they held, would proceed to act under the
Act of 1856, and proceed with the trunk and branches as they see fit. It may be they
have the power and ability to use the offices entrusted to them for the good of the
country. I am willing to give them a fair and reasonable time to mature their plans.
But we are not willing to allow them to increase the public expenditure without consulting
the people. On a question so much discussed and talked about, the Government might
readily be supposed to have arrived at a conclusion as to what course to pursue. I
understood companies were organized and were prepared to go on, but I fear that the
action of the Government will lend to upset what has been done. This paragraph does
not contain a sufficiently explicit policy as to the ideas entertained by the Government
on Railway affairs. I think the Amendment gives the Government sufficient power to
do all they need to do.
Mr. KERR. - I readily accord the view of the law as expounded by the hon. member for the City
of Saint John. I
think they are precluded as a Government from interfering with the rights of a Company
that may have intended to enter upon this work. I think it is now proceeding as well
as we could expect. We learn that it is intended to carry on the line to fill up the
gap to the Nova Scotia boundary, and that the later Government accepted the offer
made. As such be the case I think it premature to interfere with the efforts put forth
to fill up this gap. I have not yet heard that the State of Maine have yet taken up
the matter with that energy this is necessary to assure us that they will be at the
boundary before we can be there. If they care not taking measures it would be premature
for us to go forward with the portion of the work, till they are ready to meet us.
Mr. WETMORE.- I understand they are taking measures, and that a deputation will probably be here
in a few days to lay their action before us.
Mr. KERR.- Are they from the legislature or are they capitalists?
Mr. KERR.- Railways are usually built
DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1865. 17
and carried on by private capital. The
Great Trunk and Great Western lines of Canada were constructed by British Capitalists
who expected them to pay but were disappointed. When we look at Canada with its great
traffic, and see that they are not able to pay the interest on their stock as preference
claims, we ought to pause before we undertake further extension. We talk as though
we had four times the population and resources we really possess. We look at the state
of Nova Scotia and find that last year they paid $60,000 whilst we paid $90,360. We
used to be told that we would never be known till we got a debt. It strikes me we
must pretty well known on the other side by this time. At the close of the year 1863
we had to pay Baring £15,000, to meet the balance of interest against us and yet they
want to go on building the road. The report of the Commissioners state that 20,000
rails are required to replace those worn out at certain parts of the line. These cost
about one shilling a-piece and it would take from £500 to £1000 to replace them on
the track. The revenue received last year only amounted to about $20,000, not sufficient
to pay one month's interest due to Great Britain. When I see all this I think it would
be premature to undertake further works. We have had all Governments in power under
the Railway policy, and the result has been the same. If we saved up our revenues
till we were in a better condition, after having paid our debts we could go on with
the public works. We are not like Nova Scotia with her mines and minerals; we have
no gold fields; we do not go so deep into the shore fisheries, and yet they are able
to keep their debt at a lower figure than we can. Take Prince Edward Island; they
are going on faster than any other of the other Provinces. They export a vast amount
of wealth to the United States, and pay
their debt, or at least they are in a good position to be able to wipe it out at any
time. It is said we must have railroads to keep our population. What is peopleing
Australia, New Zealand, and California? Is it not emigration from other places? Why,
even in the State of Maine, a Mr. Goodall complains that something must be done. Agricultural
interests must be improved, or the young men will all go out West. I saw it stated
that lately there has been a perfect exodus from Canada. There have been many who
have left Nova Scotia since the war first began. Look at Charlotte County in 1854,
one of the most prosperous years the country ever saw; during that year young men
kept going away. Why was it? The country was prosperous. The fact is that when they
make up their minds to go, they will go, and no railways or anything else will prevent
them. I would like to see the young men go back, like their fathers did, into the
woods, and gain for themselves farms and independence. But
young men of this day want to do some-
thing easier than that. A man, as soon as he gets a few hundreds of dollars together,
must be a merchant, so that in almost every village there are ten retail shops where
one would do, and the men stand round the doors all day long with their hands in their
pockets. It is said, let us have railroads to circulate money. But. this circulation
does not last long. I would ask the hon. member for Westmorland, what benefit has
Moncton received from the Railway? I do not want to see the money go out of the country
in the shape of interest as in the past. I think the offer of $10,000 a mile a most
liberal one, and that it will be taken up,
and the work done. If the people of St. John are in earnest and want this line so
much, why don't they put their hands in their pockets and do a little more to raise
the required Stock? In the construction of the present line the land damaged amounted
to £40,000, while in Nova Scotia they did not amount to one-third that sum. After
the disappointment we have all felt at the reports of the Canadian Railways, it is
too much to say that the Government can remedy the evils that exist, and that it is
possible to find men, honest men, to fill all the offices of the country. I think
men are about as they were, and when money is placed in their way they like to get
hold of it. To go on with our road will add £16,950 more to our interest, whilst the
whole interest on our debt will amount to £158,160, and this to be paid by 250,000
people. When I look at the state of Railway stock in Canada, I find that on the Great
Western there is a loss of £12 on every paid up share of £18. Look at the state of
our stocks. I see they are quoted at from 92 to 95, and money worth 4 and 4 1-2 per
cent. During the building of the road our debentures were worth 4 and 5 per cent premium
now they are down to 92, and I don't think there is much prospect for a rise. Who
is going to invest $190,000 in carrying on our railway policy? If any one will, it
will relieve our finances very much. I see by the Act of 1856 that the branches were
to be carried on.
Hon. Mr. SMITH - The provision was
that they were to go on with the trunk or the branches as they could.
Mr. KERR. - If they are going to deal
fairly, the Government must serve all
portions of the Province alike. Seeing
all this, I cannot withdraw my amendment, and I am sure members of the
Government, were they in my circumstances, would do the same. I think it
best for the law to take its course, and
leave the work for companies to take up.
It may be that Mr. Parks will come out
and surrender his charter forthwith.
Then the Government are going to take
the matter in hand; but I would like to
know where they are going to get the
money, and if they intend to raise it on
the same terms as in 1857, I think they
will find great difficulty, as our bonds
have settled down and will not likely rise
again for some time to come.
Mr. HILL.- The hon. member for
Northumberland asked if the State of
Maine were doing anything towards
building the road on their side of the
line. The assistance given to the company, of which Mr. Poor is the President,
is one million of acres of land, subject to
a claim of Massachusetts of $250,000.
This claim, it is expected, will be given
up to the company, as the effect of building the road will be to pour a stream of
trade and travel into Boston equal to the amount. The feeling in Boston is growing
very favorable to this plan. They also receive a large unsettled claim, and $100,000
was expected to be appropriated by the last Congress, but was not got through. In
addition to this, the city of Bangor take stock in the company to the extent of $500,000,
on the condition that the line run from Bangor to Mattawamkeag Point. Their object
in pushing the line so far up is to carry the trade of Aroostook and the upper country
to Bangor instead of Saint. John. The House will see that the European and North American
Railway Company have a strong team to work
with, and it is generally supposed they
will experience no difficulty in carrying on the work. The Government there do not
build, as they have no revenue derived for that purpose. If anything were given it
would have to be raised by direct taxation.
Mr. KERR.-I would be just as free to
give them lands as the State of Maine,
and as to unsettled claims there are an indefinite amount of them, that we could
readily bestow upon any company desiring to build, but it appears the Government really
have not given one dollar toward the prosecution of the work.
On the division of the House on the amendment - Yeas 10. Nays 29.
On the division of the House, on the fifth paragraph - Yeas 27. Nays 12.
Mr. CONNELL moved that the fifth paragraph be reconsidered, and the following substituted in
its place: "We are pleased to learn that the completion and extension of the European
and North American Railway, from the frontier of Nova Scotia to the boundary of the
United States, will be undertaken. If existing laws preclude immediate action, we
will consider any measure which may be proposed for their amendment, and which will
provide for an early commencement of the work."
On division of the House on reconsideration - Yeas 2, Nays 28.
Paragraphs 6,7 and 8, were read and passed.
On the reading of the 9th,
Mr. GILBERT
asked the Government if they intended to take steps for the reduction of salaries
of public officers, and make other retrenchments.
Hon. Mr. SMITH.- It is the intention of Government to exercise the strictest economy they can, without
impairing the usefulness of public offices.
Paragraphs 10 and 11, were then read and passed.
Mr. OTTY moved that the Address be engrossed, signed by the Speaker, and presented to the
Governor by the whole House.
Mr. OTTY further moved, that a Committee be appointed to wait on His Excellency to be informed
when he will be pleased to receive them therewith.
Mr. WILMOT moved for leave to bring in a Bill to prepare an Act for the Incorporation of the
Carleton and Saint John Ship Building and Trading Company. Also, presented a petition
from G. Allen and others, praying for said Act of Incorporation.
Mr. BOYD presented a petition from the Ministers, Elders and Trustees of the Church of Scotland,
praying that certain Bills before the House may pass.
Mr. BOYD moved for leave to bring in a Bill to provide for the payment of the expenses of
Grand Jurors.
Mr. NEEDHAM moved for leave to bring in a Bill relating to the registry of Bills of Sale of personal
chattels.
Hon. Mr. ALLEN moved the House into Committee on the Bill to revive and continue the Act to regulate
the sale of Spirituous Liquors.
House in Committee-Mr. McClellan in the Chair.
Mr. ALLEN said, this was an Act to revive and continue an Act of 1854. That law expires to-day.
Adopted.
The SPEAKER having taken the Chair, on motion, the Bill became law.
Adjourned till 9 a.m. to-morrow.
J.M.
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