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Legislative Assembly, 3 June 1867, New Brunswick Confederation Debates

122 DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1867.

MONDAY, June 3rd, 1867.

SECOND READINGS.

The following Bills were read a second time :
A Bill to incorporate the Eastern Bank of New Brunswick, in the County of Westmorland.
A Bill in amendment of the Act to incorporte the Woodstock Railway Company.
A Bill to incorporate the Grand Loyal Ribbon Society of New Brunswick.

THIRD READINGS.

The following Bills were read a third time :
A Bill to incorporate the Saint John Mercantile Marine Assurance Company.
A Bill to authorize the erection of a Sorting Boom on Eel River, in the Counties of York and Carleton.
A Bill to provide for the more effectually repairing of the streets, roads and bridges of the lower highway district in the Parish of Saint Stephen.
A Bill to establish an additional Polling Place in the County of Carleton.

FIRE LOAN BONDS.

Mr. SMITH.—I see by the returns which have been laid before the House on the Fire Loan Bonds, that the Solicitor Generel has compromised with some of the parties, and that in some cases a great reduction has been made. Now I should like to know by whose authority this was done, for I think that they have been settled up at a much greater sacrifice than was required to be made.
Hon. Mr. WILLISTON.—I may say that each case was submitted to Council, and an order of Council was made out on each one.
Mr. SMITH.— I should certainly like to see them.
Hon. Mr. WILLISTON.—I will bring them down to-morrow.
Mr. SMITH.— I now give notice that I shall, at as early a day as the rules will permit, move the House into Committee upon these Papers and Returns.

BILL TO PREVENT DUAL REPRESENTATION.

Hon. Mr. WILLISTON moved the House into Committee on a Bill relating to Members of the House of Assembly.
Mr. YOUNG in the Chair.
Hon. Mr. WILLISTON.—This Bill provides two principles ; first, that no person who is returned as a member for the House of Commons of Canada can sit or vote in this House ; and secondly, that any person who may now occupy a seat in the Legislative Coun DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1867. 123 cil, if elected or appointed to a seat at Ottawa, shall vacate his seat in the Local Legislature. An Act of this nature has been passed in Nova Scotia, and it is of some importance that it should also pass here. As to our power to legislate on matters of this kind, I think it is clearly given to us in section 129 of the Imperial Act, where it is said that all powers and authorities which we hold at the time of Union, except as otherwise provided by the Act, shall remain and continue in force as if the Act had not been made, showing clearly that we have the power to amend our constitution if we see fit. The passing of this Bill is called for, as an act of duty to those who may be left here when the Union is consummated, and may have left this House to represent the people at Ottawa ; for there are many persons in the country who will readily come forward and here be schooled for higher positions in the Dominion, who, if dual representation was permitted, would be entirely shut out from political life. This is the idea of the Bill, and I believe it commends itself to the minds of every honorable member in this House.
Mr. SMITH.—I am not at all opposed to the principle laid down in this Bill, but I should like to see the Attorney General in his place, for I want to ask him a few questions. It is said that he is one of those who are perfectly willing to represent the people at Ottawa, and at the same time hold on to a seat in this House, especially if £600 is attached to it. This idea, I believe, he put forth publicly here in Fredericton, and it is said there are others who are quite willing to do the same thing. In Canada they have taken no steps to prevent dual representation ; indeed I see that the leading minds in the Government there seem to foster the idea of holding seats in both Houses. I should certainly like to know the sentiments of the members of the Government on the question, as to whether we can legislate in this matter. We are now pursuing a novel course. Here we have a man, who is said to be a Senator of the Dominion of Canada, whose name is in the Proclamation, yet he is still holding his seat here, is a member of the Government and Chief Commissioner of Public Works. I don't see how the Government can reconcile that to the provisions of the Act. The names of the Senators for Canada are given and published in the papers, but here we can get no information whatever. The Government are as reticent as ever, and won't tell us anything that is going on. To judge by their actions they don't know what they are going to do at all. The Attorney General told us he was going to introduce a Bill for a change in the Magistrates' Courts. He went to the expense of getting the Bill printed, and it has been sent to the people, but all at once we are told that it is not going to be brought in. This is a most extraordinary course to pursue ; I never heard the like of it before. But it seems that all who are connected with this question of Union are determined to mystify and keep the people in suspense. I see now that Mr. D'Arcy McGee has put forth, here just before the Union is consummated, that after all Confederation is not quite the thing, and that shortly we must inevitably settle down into a Legislative Union. We are hardly entered into one Union before these men want to pull down the structure they have raised, and erect another. He says also, that every man must be called out to drill, and thus every man is to be made a soldier, as is done in Prussia, where every man, prince and peasant alike, has to serve two or three years at military practice. I regard the present as perilous times for our people, the clouds of trouble seem gathering very thick about us, but I hope that some thing will yet occur to prevent the impending evils. As to this measure I think the delegates should have provided for it in the Imperial Act, but it seems as though they had made up their minds to hold on to their offices here and go to Ottawa as well, if they could get the chance. The people, however, have shown their opposition to such a course, and so at the last the Government make up their mind to provide against it. I think the measure is a good one, and therefore I shall give it my support.
Mr. JOHNSON. As one of the delegates I could not have agreed to make any provision like this binding by Imperial Statute. The delegates had no power to lay down what course should be pursued, for it was a privilege of the people to say whether their representatives should be allowed to hold a seat in the General as well as the Local Legislature. But whilst I could not agree to have it laid down in the Act, yet I had very decided feelings as to the requirement of such an Act as this ; for there may arise an occasion when the Local and General Parliaments are in conflict, and to have the twelve or fifteen men who represent the Province at Ottawa to come back and take their seat here, might prove disastrous to the best interests of the country. I have felt all along that it would be putting a power into their hands which they should not possess. To avoid any such difficulties this Bill has been introduced, and I am sure that it will meet with the approbation of the people.
Hon. Mr. TILLEY.—It is a great pity that my hon. friend from Westmorland should be so much affected by what Mr. McGee may think or say, but I am under the impression that he might be much more so if he would take to heart the language used by a candidate on the other side in Nova Scotia, who, if report is true, has given vent to his feelings by the use of language which is to be deprecated by every loyal subject in British America. I do not think, however, that in this House we should be guided by what Mr. McGee or Mr. Howe may say in their private capacity. When my  hon. friend gets to Ottawa, for they say he is sure to go there, if Mr. McGee brings up a measure to make the people of the Dominion spend a certain time every year in military drill, he can then stand up and oppose it ; but it is not necessary to bring the matter in here. The fact is, Mr. McGee has an idea that the militia of the Confederation should be made more efficient, and the same idea has been expressed by the Administrator of the Government here. But there was a time, Mr. Chairman, when the people of this Province had to turn out and drill for three or four days every year. It may have proved a hardship for them to do it sometimes, but I greatly mistake the feelings of our people if they would not be willing to do it again to put themselves in a position to defend their firesides from the attack of an invader. But my hon. friend is also very much tried too, because Mr. McGee says, that we shall ultimately have to come to a Legislative Union. But if I mistake not my hon. friend made this very thing one of the points of his objections to the Quebec Scheme, and laid it down as the ground of his belief why the Union contemplated should not be gone into. And as to the question now before us, dual representation, as it is called, there is an impression generally abroad that the hon. member from Westmorland favored the idea ; I know it was so believed in his own County. Now, I never had but one idea on this matter, and that was that it was incompatible with the interests of the country that a man should hold seats in both Houses. I believe this principle will become general all over the Dominion. My hon. friend speaks of the withdrawal of a Bill, a draft of which was before the House, and which the Attorney General had contemplated carrying through, as a great crime. Why, Mr. Chairman, after consulting with our friends on that subject, we found that there was no possibility of passing it, and so it was withdrawn. I don't see anything very dreadful in that. But he says the Attorney General must have changed his ideas very much if he is willing the present Bill should pass. The Attorney General is not present, and therefore he cannot answer as to his ideas on this question, but I think I remember a very important occasion on which the opinions of my hon. friend were said to have changed. It was said 124 DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1867 that he was not unfavorable to Confederation under certain provisions, but when he came to the House he we directly against it. He seems to take every opportunity day and night, in the House and out of it, to alarm the people as to the future prospects of this country, which he characterizes as dark and gloomy and perilous, and all that. It is true the state of trade is dull at present, but we looking to the Union to aid in a material degree, in relieving the distress which at present is felt in certain quarters, and there is no necessity at all to picture out the future as all darkness and ruin. As to the Senators. It seems that a paper in Canada has a reppresentative in regard who has telegraphed out the names as contained in the proclamation, so far as regards Canada ; but we have not incurred that expense and therefore are not yet in a position to make known who have been appointed. As to the Chief Commissioner of the Board of Works being able, under the Act, to hold his seat, it is my private opinion that there is nothing to prevent his doing so till the first of July, the day on which the Union will be consummated ; yes, Mr. Chairman, that he can do so just as legally as the hon. member for Westmorland, whose name, I may tell him, is not in the Proclamation.
Mr. SMITH.—No, it is not in the Proclamation, for the Secretary is well aware that I would take no favors at their hands, and if they had asked me to have it put on, I should not have allowed it. The Secretary says that I changed my opinion on Confederation ; but, Mr. Chairman, I have answered that charge over and over again. He knows very well that the paragraph in the Speech was put there by the Governor, who said the Government were not responsible for it, but he expressed the sentiments which he was authorised to do by instructions from the Mother Country. But why should he refer to this? He knows the backstair influence which was used to get that inserted, and that it reflects no credit on the parties engaged in it. He says I changed my opinion. I deny it. But he went to England an anti-confederate, and returned a Confederate. I went an Anti, and returned an Anti. When I think of what was done to oust the Government of which I was a member, I can scarcely restrain my feelings. The administration of the Secretary was a stain and a blot upon the history of this Province And when our of power he used all sorts of treachery and backstair influence to get in again. They worked with Governor Gordon in the tyrnnical course he pursued towards the people of this country, but I should like to know the opinion on the Government on Governor Gordon now. I am willing to go back to the people on the question then at issue, and leave the verdict with them. The Secretary talks about the great benefits which Union ere going to confer upon us, end of the good times that are coming. I hope the result will be as satisfactory as he depicts, but I say the signs of the time indicate that troublous times are coming. I am surprised that he should treat with the levity the opinions of such a man as D'Arcy McGee, who he knows speaks the opinions of the Government of which he is a member ; and he says that a Legislative Union is inevitable, and that very shortly. The Secretary says I was in favor of a Legislative Union, but I never was. I was always of the opinion that no Union with Canada could be obtained that would be fair and equitable for us. Here we are now on the very verge of Union, and we are to pay $50,000 for Governor General, and other expenses of Government greater than is required to carry on the affairs of the United States. The Secretary has referred to Joe Howe, but does not tell us what is so very objectionable that he has said. He is one of the most eminent men in British North America, and his voice will be resound in the Halls of Ottawa —they can't keep him out—and a large member of his friends will be with him. He has ever been loyal to the British Crown—none more so. His speeches have ever breathed a spirit of loyalty and devotion, and what does the Secretary mean? As to Nova Scotia we shall soon see how many of the men who have betrayed their country can be returned by the people. Yes, I believe the people will rise in their might and show who it is that have the power. Never were a people so betrayed and trampled on in this history of the world as have been the people of Nova Scotia. The Secretary says that day and night, in the House and out, I take every opportunity of opposing Union. How does he know? has he pimps about me at night? I don't know, but it seems that everything I do and say becomes known to the Secretary. He says that I was in favor of dual representation ; what I said was that I had not seen the Act, but that the members of Government in Canada was urging it strongly on their friends, and I supposed the practice would be uniform in all the Provinces. As to Mr. Howe, no one ever heard or saw anything in him approaching disloyalty, but the Secretary knows that when the question of loyalty is touched upon, a throb of excitement and feeling is felt by the people, and they are all ready to go in and show it at all risks. But Mr. Howe is now a private gentleman, without official capacity at all, and should not be named. It is very different with Mr. McGee. He is a public officer, high in the confidence of the Government, and as such when he speaks he speaks the language and feel ings and sentiments of the Government. The Secretary says that all he asks for is that the militia should be put in a more efficient state, but is not so. His idea is to organize a standing army, and keep it up by the services of the able bodied strength of the community. The Secretary refers to the three or four days formerly spent in drilling our people, and says they would be willing to do it again. But we all know that those occasions of muster produced nothing but vice and immortality ; ad I would ask are we to go back to such times? Is history to repeat itself? That old practice was a burden on the people, they rejoiced when they were relived from it, and have no desire to have it imposed upon them again. The Secretary says there is no cause for alarm. That is a very different cry than was raised when the Fenians were on the border. It was said they came down in the interest of the Antis, and declare I themselves their friends, when they, by that very statement, cut our throats, and   played a very important part generally in the election contest. He says that l oppose whatever comes up, but I think I have shown a great deal of forbearance all through the Session. I have tried to get information upon certain points, but the Government seem afraid to let the public know anything at all. And sec the cowardice and pusilanimity they displayed in withdrawing a Bill which they had put before the House and country. The Attorney General said he was going to press the Bill, but he has told an untruth—It has been wthdrawn. And what have the Government been doing ? I hnow some of them have been enjoying themselvey pretty well ; but where is the Report of the Chief Commissioner of the Board of Works ? Where is the Postmaster General's Report? Where is the Report of the Surveyor General? All the accounts are closed down to the 31st October, and one would suppose they hed plenty of time to make them up by the time the House meets ; but here the Session is well advanced, and scarcely any of the Government Reports before us. Some of them have been away in England, and it is said they met with a very hearty reception, but where have the rest been? I came up here once, and there was not a single member of the Government to be found. Mr. Fulton was the governing power then. As to this Bill. as I said before, I think it will prove beneficial, but if, in speaking upon this or any other question, I see fit to touch upon other matters aiiecting the general welfare of the public, I shall do so without asking permission of the Secretary.
Mr. BECKWITH.— This discussion is taking a much wider range than I sup DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1867. 125 posed it would have done, but as I have no past difficulties to complain of, and no evils to redress, I shall confine the few remarks I make to the question before us. These are, I think, many strong reasons why this Bill should pass. It is probable that the Houses both here and at Ottawa will meet in the winter, and hence if a member held a seat in both he would have to leave one or the other vacant, and we may be very sure it would not be the one at Ottawa. Then it is probable that many questions will arise, in which the General and Local Legislatures will not agree. No doubt laws will be passed here which will go to Ottawa and be there discussed, and these men who were in the minority here might there be able to wield an influence suficient to have it repealed. It is evident that a man cannot faithfully serve two masters or two interests, and therefore he should not be placed in the awkward position of being compelled to sacrifice the interest of either of his constituencies. I think the rule should also be carried out in Canada, and it is probable that it will be ; but even though it should not be, we shall not suffer by it. Neither do I think that because it was not put in the Act of Union any reflection should be cast on the delegates. They did right I think in leaving it to the decision of the people by their representatives, and they expressed the general feeling of the people in doing so. I will say one word as  to the militia. I am not one of those who look upon the old system of training for four days as the cause of so much vice and immorality. I have seen quite as much drunkenness—for that is the immorality referred to—at our Agricultural Exhibitions, at our Crown Land Sales, at our Fairs and Races as I ever saw at a training ; and to say that we should not prepare ourselves for war in times of peace, is the same as to say that we should not obtain engines till our houses are on fire. I do not fear for the future of this country. I remember the war of 1812, for I was a boy then, and I know the position of the United States then was no better than ours is now. There were troubles all along our borders, but small as we were then, I know that their attacking forces were always driven back, and in some cases whole regiments were captured, and I have no apprehension that we should fall a prey to them, now that we are in a so much better position, even if they tried to subdue us. I do not believe in the Prussian system of taking all the available strength of the country and converting it to military purposes, but I think a plan will be decided on that will prove quite effective without being a great burden upon the people.
Hon. Mr. TILLEY.—Although the hon. member for Westmoreland appeared very much alarmed as to the future of this country, I thought it was but in appearance, and it must now be highly satisfactory to the House and country to know from his own lips that he does not feel that alarm and dread which his words would have seemed to imply. As to his forbearance this Session in not opposing the Government, I thank him for it, but with all his forbearance he cannot withhold using very strong language toward us. For example, he has called us a cowardly Government ; but I know that we have not shown ourselves to be so. When my hon. friend was in the Government with us, I think we fought out the question of the Intercolonial Railway, and I am sure we did not exhibit any such spirit in the question of Union. We took our stand and went to the people upon it. If cowardice was shown in Nova Scotia, I am sure there was none in New Brunswick, and I defy him to put his hand upon one act of the Government which will bear such a title. The only case that I know of where there was an exhibition of cowardice, was in the case I have referred to, when within the last fifteen months a Government took a stand on the question of Union by submitting it in the Speech from the Throne and then backed out from it directly they came upon the floors of the House. I deprecated the introduction of expressions of the opinions of Mr. McGee or any one else, and my hon. friend says that he speaks for his Government ; but how can that be the opinions of the Confederate Government ? That Mr. Howe, as he says, may be in the Legislature at Ottawa, is within the bounds of possibility, but that does not affect what he may have said in Nova Scotia. It is true, his speeches, as reported, have not always been acknowledged, and it may be the case with Mr. McGee. He may have been reported as uttering expressions which he may never have used. The hon. member says he is not for a Legislative Union, but at the same time he acknowledges that he would rather have that than a Federal Union. He charges the delegates with being away a long time and not doing anything. That might very well apply to the delegation of 1865, but not to that of 1866. He does acknowledge that we have got more money than we should have had under the Quebec Scheme ; well, that's something we did. But we did more ; we decided on resolutions as the basis of Union ; we obtained the passage of an Imperial Act of Union ; we got the guaranatee for the Inter-colonial Railway, and we also obtained concessions on the Bill which many thought we could not get. I think this looks like something more than glorifying ourselves.
Mr. SMITH.—What about the white satin breeches ?
Hon. Mr. TILLEY.— I never saw them. I have heard a good deal about them, but I have not been fortunate enough to see them. My hon. friend is mistaken as to the white satin breeches ; you know when he was there, although he had the honor of an interview, it was in morning dress. Well Sir, since the matter has been referred to, I may say that we went by command of Her Majesty. We went once in morning dress and afterward received Her Majesty's command to appear in full dress. But, Sir, we did not feel that the honor was to us personally, but to the people of New Brunswick, and to us as their representatives. The hon. member asks if we are to enact history over again ? I answer that, in some cases, the people of this Province are prepared and willing to enact history over again. The old arrangement of training occupied four days, and then we came down to one, and it was not found to be as good ; for everybody then said, what is the use of drilling a man one day in the year ? he does not learn anything. I believe the people now are ready to move and go into this matter with all their heart, and fit themselves for any emergency which may arise. There are in these Provinces at the present time four hundred thousand efficient militia men enrolled ; and suppose we could, in times of danger, call out but one hundred thousand of these, would the knowledge that we had at our command such a force be sufficient in itself to prevent an ordinary aggression ? I think the people are prepared to do something more than they have in this direction, and if any measure, with the object of putting the militia on a more efficient footing is introduced, I think it will meet the approbation of the people. My hon. friend has referred to the Fenians, and asks if their coming had not some effect on the elections ? I think it had, and a most decided one, for when they came and said they were prepared to assist the Antis in preventing Confederation, the feeling in favor of Union at once became more general, for the people saw that in that alone was safety. He talks about the gloomy future, but I am not afraid of our prospects. To-morrow, in order to prepare the way for the assimilation of our commercial relations with those of the other Provinces under Union, I shall bring in a Bill relating to our fiscal and tariff arrangements, by which the duties on certain articles will be reduced four per cent ; but I suppose my hon. friend won't support that. I do not doubt, however, but that we have full powers to act in this matter. He says that the Attorney General expressed an opinion in favor of dual representation in public. I did not hear him, but I saw in the papers that he had made some remarks tending that 126 DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1867. way. But the hon. member is aggrieved because it was not put down in the Act that it would not be permitted. We were all unanimous on the subject, but had no power to deal with it, and even if we had possessed the power, it would not have been expedient to do so.
Mr. SMITH. -It is a novel idea that the Delegates had not the power. Why, they were acting as the representatives of the Home of Commons, and had full powers to decide on any question affecting the interests of the Dominion. The Secretary says he is going to bring in a Bill to aller the Tariff, and says it can be done. When I asked him the other day to take stock in Western Extension he said it could be done, but I find that it is denounced in the other branch, and that consequently the Government are not going to do it. So they have changed their policy on that question, it seems. He says that we have four hundred thousand men enrolled as Militia, but I ask him what our revenues are to keep up these men in time of war, or how long they would last to keep up a standing army of one hundred thousand? Our people are thoroughly loyal, but I do not believe they are willing, at a time when things are in such a bad state, with flour at $11 or $12 a barrel, and distress prevailing everywhere, to keep up a large body of standing Militia. Now he takes credit to himself for what was done in England ; but I say if changes were obtained in the Quebec Scheme, the present Government cannot take the credit, for they pronounced that scheme faultless. I find that some changes have been made for the better, but many more for the worse. He has now made public the fact that the Delegates had two interviews with Her Majesty ; I thought there was but one. He says it was no honor done to him, but to the people. Well, if that is the case, I think we ought to see the dress in which he appeared—they say it cost £60. I saw that while in England the Secretary was presented with an address, in which he was lauded to the skies for the sacrifices he had made. It gave the whole of his political history, and it seems strange how they became acquainted with it all. The papers state that he was so choked with emotion that he could scarely reply. I suppose it was all right, although I should like to know something of the great sacrifices which he has been called upon to make.
Mr. JOHNSON.— The debate has taken a much wider range than I thought it would have done, and some remarks have been made that I feel called on to allude to. Reference has been made to Confederation, and a gentleman has been named who does not reside in the Province, and if I remained silent it might be thought that I concur in what has been said. Mr. Howe has been from my earliest infancy my tutor. I always have looked to him as a leader worthy to be followed, and if now he is attacked, it must be remembered that it is Howe attacking Howe. When I first came into public life I met Mr. Howe at Stubbs' Hotel, in Saint John, and my hon. friend who was present will remember the man with the high shirt collar. Well, we had some conversation,—but I will not say what it was. I will speak of him as a Colonist, and when I heard and read what he said to the British Government, I thought it strange that a men who had gone to the United States and had to sleep in different beds every night to escape detection, I say I thought it strange that he should say to the British Government that we should not go into Union lest the United States might take umbrage and take measures to annex us. When he, as a Colonist, pandered to the men who, for the commercial advantages which might arise to England from prolonged peace and amity with the United States, were willing to prevent our uniting together, I thought it very strange, and I felt that through troubles arose from it, and this were the battle ground, the people of this Province would boldly and bravely stand up for the defence of their homes and hearths against the United States in such a cause. I do not think the United States Government want to annex us, but there is a power behind them urging them on. Howe said that if we were united it might give offence to a foreign power, and I felt, as a Colonist, that England would consider us wanting in that pluck and self-reliance which has ever characterized the English race. My hon. friend from Westmorland has said that it is intended to make us all soldiers, and that it will be no better than it is in Prussia. But I would ask him if we can show me a nation more high in patriotism, in position and prosperity than Prussia? If the making us all soldiers will make us like that country, we need not be afraid of it ; I believe in making a man fit to fight, even though he may not have to do it. On the principle of the Bill my hon. friend and I concur, but as reference was made to Mr. Howe I thought it best to make these remarks. I do not think it is judicious to bring him into discussion ; but if he is, and is lauded, all we have to do is to show what his past life has been and what he is now.
Hon. Mr. TILLEY.— The question has been asked me, why it is that the hon. member for Westmorland takes up so much time in denouncing Confederation ? Of course, it is expected to have some effect. We all know that is the policy of the opponents of Union to get as many of their number at Ottawa as possible, and these speeches now will save a good deal of time at the hustings, as they are all reported in the papers and Debates. My hon. friend asked, What has Confederation done thus far? He says the people are poor and the times are bad. We have not yet entered into Confederation, and therefore it cannot be expected to have done much for us, but thus far even it has had the effect of giving confidence in the capabilities and resources of the country to be developed under Confederation to persons who would otherwise have left the country. He says I changed my views, but he knows that I was willing to get the very best terms possible, and if we could not get any changes made then I was willing to take the basis of the Quebec Scheme And he asks, Who should take the credit for the changes made? Well. Mr. Chairman, certainly not those who have been from the first opposed to Union on any terms. If my hon. friend had changed his position, as many others have done all over the Province, and which he says he has not done, then he might have taken some of the credit to himself, but not now. He says we are all to be made soldiers, and asks where the revenues are to come from to support a standing army? But it is not intended to call them out and keep them up, but only to place the Militia upon a good footing. He says I indulge in a good deal of self glorification, and referred to an address which was presented to me by my Temperance friends, asking how they got their information. Well, they did not get it from me. I am not the man who talks in the House or on the platform of the personal sacrifices I have made. He says I was choked with emotion. Well, I did not know that I was able to do much that way, but that is a forte possessed very strongly by my hon. friend. I remember when I was lecturing on Union in Westmorland some one said to me, "You should come the pathetic as Smith does," and hon. members well know that peculiar tremor in his voice, so fitted to create an impression on his listeners, when he feels deeply on any subject. Seelng that my hon. friend is not free from this, I may be well pardoned if, on an occasion like that, I should find a difficulty of expressing myself, and my friends may have thought I was more deeply affected than in reality I was. As to the expressions of praise I heve remarked that as a general rule our friends pile it on a little too much one side, while our enemies do the same thing the other side. I have to apologize for taking up so muoh of the time, but it was called for by the hon. member for Westmorland travelling out of the record to make Confederation the cause of the distress and dullness which prevails, when in reality we are looking forward to Union to remedy it.
DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1867.127
Mr. CHANDLER. - I see no purpose to be gained in prolonging this discussion. The question of Union has bee gone over and over again, and it is well picked to the bone. When the Delegates went home we thought too many were sent; but the work before them was great and wanted all the light that could be thrown upon it. They have done their work and done it well, and the people are satisfied. A great deal of ridicule has been casto on what was done there; but, sir, when our Delegates went home we expected them to conform to the manners of the people and the usages of society. Did my hon. friend from Westmorland expect they were going to eat soup with a horn spoon, or burgoo with their fingers? - (laughter.) When they appeared at Court for presentation to Her Majexty they were dressed as very body has been since the days of Charles I.; and, sir, it must be remembered that when franklin went hom as a Delegate from the United States he appeared be- form King George III. in just such a costume. I have heard a good deal said about the dress and the perturbation of feelings exhibited. It is said that one of our Delegates got up at three o'clock in the morning to wriggle himself into his white satin breeches, but I don't believe it. However, they accomplished their purpose, and I have heard but one expression of opinion upon the result. We now look forward to see the lumberman, the agriculturist, and every department benefitted by the Union upon which we are about to enter. It is time that many young men who have gone away from Charlotte because ther was no work of a remunerative character to do, but I know that many of them hold themselves in readiness to come back directly the country shows signs of being able to give them a comfortable means of support.
Mr. SMITH. - The Secretary seems to like to make fun of men. He quotes from private conversations I have had with persons, and says my style of speaking is pathetic. My voice may not be so clear and full - I may not be so finished in my style, so eloquent or so great a purist as the Secretary; but I think that he beings to feel that his glowing descriptions of the prosperity we were to enjoy under Confederation are not going to be realised. He says he never talks about the sacrifices he has made, and for very good reason - I never knew him to make any. Ever since he has been in the House he has held an office with a salary of £600 a year, and so he never made any sacrifices. As to what Mr. McGee said, it was not that the Militia were to be put upon a good footing, but that we were to have a universal armament, and that we must have a Legislative Union shortly; and I referred to him because he is a public man and a member of the Canadian Government. When I spoke of him I spoke of a public man whose acts and words may be criticised; but when the Secretary referred to Mr. Howe he spoke of a private man, which was wrong. I have not the ability to defend Mr. Howe as he should be, but the question on both sides has been argued out and is before the public. I dare say my remarks are are tedious to some hon. members, going over the same ground again and again, but I am here to represent the country and cannot let statements go unchallenged, and so shall refer to Confederation and the events which occur around us,- in Canada, in England, or anywhere else, - and shall not ask permission of the Secretary, either.
The question upon reading the Bill section by section was then taken and carried in the affirmative.
The Bill was then read and agreed to without further debate.

BILLS.

Mr. CHANDLER moved for leave to bring in a Bill relating to Trade Marks.
Leave was granted and the Bill read a first time.
Mr. KERR moved for leave to bring in a Bill in amendment of the Act to incorporate the Northern Bank.
Leave was granted and the Bill read a first time.
Mr. STEVENS moved for leave to bring in a Bill to amend the Act to incorporate the SAint Stephen's Branch Railway Company.
Leave was granted and the Bill read a first time.
The New brunswick Telegraph Bill was recommitted, and further progress immediately made, to allow the other Telegraph Bills to be recommitted with it.
Mr. YOUNG in the Chair.

MESSAGES.

Hon. Mr. McCLELLAN, by command of His Excellency, laid before the House the Annual Report of the Chief Commissioner of the Board of Works.
Hon. Mr. McMILLAN, by command of His Excellency, laid before the House the Annual Report of the Postmaster General.

PAPERS.

Hon. Mr. CONNELL laid before the House copies of Orders in Council relating to the Labor Act.

PETITION.

Hon. Mr. McADAM presented the Petition of William Young and others, inhabitants of the County of Charlotte, praying that a Bill may pass to prevent non-resident Pedlers from travelling and selling within the Province.
The Petition was received and laid on the table.

NOTICE OF MOTION

Mr. SMITH gave notice that he should on Thursday next move the following address:
"Resolved,That an humble address be presented to the Administrator of the Government, asking for all Correspondence, Memorandums, and Minutes of Council in any way relating to the late delegation to England, together with copies of all telegrams received by the Delegates or either of them while at Halifax either from the Government of Canada or any member of it, or from the late Lieutenant Governor of this Province. Also copies of all telegrams received from Canada before the delegates left relating to their mission, and the time the delegates from Canada intended leaving."

PEDDLERS' BILL.

Hon. Mr. McADAM moved the House into Committee on a Bill to prevent nonresident Peddlers from travelling and selling within the Province.
Mr. LINDSAY in the Chair.
Hon. Mr. McADAM said that Peddlers were not permitted to come over from the United States and sell from their waggons even in front of a country store, while our people were not permitted to go to the United states and sell at all. There was much complaint about it from store keepers, and this Bill was brought in to remedy the evil.
Mr. SMITH thought it was not wise to pass any such Bill as this, as if they sold cheaper than the stores the people got the benefit.
Hon. Mr. WILLISTON said Peddlers rwere required to take out a license before they could sell.
Mr. QUINTON said that law only applied to the City of Saint John. They were allowed to sell at all other places without a licence.
Mr. LEWIS said if our people were not allowed to peddle in the United States, we ought not to allow them to come over here and sell. He believed the true principle in this was to do as you are done by.
Hon. Mr. TILLEY thought that something ought to be done, but that it would not be prudent to exclude them altogether. Our own peddlers are taxed on the real and personal property, and should be protected in some way, and he thought if non-residents were compelled [...]
192

APPENDIX.

(See Debates, May 22nd.)

Hon. Mr. TILLEY, by command of His Excellency the Administrator of the Government, laid before the House the following message:
"HASTINGS DOYLE.
His Excellency the Administrator of the Government lays before the House of Assembly a copy of the Report of the Delegates appointed to confer with the Imperial Government, and the Government of Canada and Nova Scotia, with regard to the Union of British North America.
May 22nd, 1867. H.D."

DELEGATION TO ENGLAND.

REPORT OF THE DELEGATION TO ENGLAND, TO ARRANGE FOR A UNION OF THE BRITISH NORTH AMERICAN PROVINCES.

FREDERICTON, N. B., 8th MAY, 1867.
May it please Your Excellency,
The undersigned Delegates, appointed by the Lieutenant Governor to arrange with her Majesty's Government a Scheme of Union for the British North American Provinces, with the exception of the Hon. P. Mitchell and the Hon. J. M. Johnson, who sailed some days later, reached Liverpool on the 28th July last, in company with the Delegates from Nova Scotia, and immediately transmitted the following telegram to the Right Honorable the Secretary of State for Colonies :
"Can Your Lordship favor Nova Scotia and New Brunswick Delegates with a brief interview on Monday next ; and if so, at what hour?
(Signed) CHARLES TUPPER, S. L. TILLEY."
The same day the following reply was received :
"Lord Carnarvon will be most happy to receive the Delegates from Nova Scotia and New Brunswick on Monday next, at three P.M."
In accordance with this intimation, the Delegates from Nova Scotia and New Brunswick waited upon His Lordship at the Colonial Office, and explained fully the position of the Confederation question, and expressed the hope that the Delegates from Canada, when they found that the Delegates from the Martime Provinces had proceeded to London, would follow them by the Canadian steamer of the 21st, and that they would soon arrive. Lord Carnarvon expressed the desire of Her Majesty's Government to promote the object of this mission, and said he would telegraph at once to Canada by the Cable.
On the 31st July the following note was received from Lord Carnarvon's Private Secretary :
JULY 31st, 1866.
SIR,—I am directed by Lord Carnarvon to inform you, that immediately after your interview of yesterday, he telegraphed to the Officer Administering Canada, enquiring whether the Delegates from that Province had already started for Europe. No answer has yet been received, and owing to the intermission in the wire between Newfoundland and the main land, no immediate answer can be counted on.
"As furthermore the Canadian Delegates have not yet been reported by telegram as having passed Londonderry, we cannot in any event expect to see them in London before the end of this week.
"Under these circumstances, Lord Carnarvon, after much consideration, finds it impossible to hold out any hope of proposing any measure to Parliament during the very short remnant of the Session.
DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1867 123
"Lord Carnarvon wishes me to add, that such must be the answer which he will be obliged to make to-night to the House of Lords to a question of which notice has been given, as to the steps which he proposed to take with regard to Confederation.
"Should you, Sir, or any of the gentlemen who are with you, wish to be present in the House of Lords to-night, Lord Carnarvon will have the greatest pleasure in introducing you. He has also written to request that places may be provided for you in the House of Commons.
I have, &c.
(Signed) CECIL C. GRAHAM.
The Hon. S L. Tilley.
On the 12th of September, the following letter was addressed to Lord Carnarvon:
Alexandra Hotel, Sept. 12th, 1866.
MY LORD.— As Delegates from the Provinces of Nova Scotia and New Brunswick, appointed to confer with Delegates from Canada and with Her Majesty's Government, upon the question of a Confederation of the British North American Provinces, we are naturally anxious to terminate the suspense in which we have been left since our arrival here, relative to the time when we may hope to accomplish the object of our mission.
"Believing, as we do, that the abrogation of the Reciprocity Treaty and the Fenian invasion of Canada, were largely owing to the failure of the Provinces we represent to agree promptly to form a united Government, as proposed by the Quebec Conference in 1864, and approved by the Imperial Government, and that the adoption of Confederation would be the best means of securing the renewal of that Treaty and discouraging Fenian designs upon British America, the Governments of Nova Scotia and New Brunswick have been most anxious that no time should be lost in accomplishing the Union of the Provinces.
"With that view, Messrs. Tupper and Archibald visited Ottawa on the 29th of June last, and after conferring with His Excellency the Governor General and the Canadian Government, it was mutually agreed that Delegates from the two Lower Provinces should proceed to England by the steamer leaving Halifax on the 19th July, and that Delegates from Canada should follow by the steamer leaving Quebec on the 21st July.
"Subsequently, Lord Monck intimated by telegraph that the change of Government in England would render it necessary to hear from England before the departure of the Delegates. The Delegates from Nova Scotia and New Brunswick, after the arrival of the latter at Halifax, jointly communicated to the Canadian Government their views as to the necessity for immediate action, and their intention to leave on the 19th July, as arranged at Ottawa ; and it was only on the eve of their departure that the received a telegram from the Hon. J. A. McDonald, saying that Lord Monck declined to go to England or to send a Delegation until authorised by the new Secretary of State. At the interview with which we were honored by your Lordship on our arrival in London on the 30th July, we understood your Lordship to say that you would send a message by the Atlantic Cable to the Governor General, asking if the Canadian Delegates had late, and if not, requesting that they would come without delay. Your Lordship subsequently did us the honor to inform us that a despatch had been sent on the 11th August, requesting the Governor General to arrange for the Canadian Delegates to proceed to England as soon as possible, and expressing the hope that in any case they would not be later than the latter part of September.
"Although we have, since our arrival, been favored with frequent opportunities of discussing the question of Confederation with your Lordship, and other members of Her Majesty's Government, we have, up to the present time, received no information as to the period when we may expect the Delegates from Canada. We feel it therefore due to the Provinces we represent, that we should respectfully solicit your Lordship to ascertain, and communicate to us, how soon we may expect the Delegates from Canada to arrive here, in order that we may govern ourselves accordingly.
We have, &c. (Signed) CHARLES TUPPER, S.L. TILLEY,
To the Right Honorable the Earl of Carnarvon, Seceretary of State for the Colonies."
On the same day this reply was received :
Downing Street, 12th Sept., 1866.
"GENTLEMEN,—I am directed by the Earl of Carnarvon, to acknowledge your letter of this day's date, requesting His Lordship to ascertain how soon you may expect the arrival of the Delegates from Canada.
"I am desired to acquaint you that his Lordship telegraphed to Lord Monck on this subject after the interview to which you allude in your letter, but that he has not had a specific answer, nor is in possession of any information beyond what he has communicated to the Delegates at various times. On the receipt, however, of your present letter, Lord Carnarvon had telegraphed, to state the inconvenience to which the Delegates of the Lower Provinces are subject by the delay, and to enquire distinctly when their Canadian colleagues start for England.
"Lord Carnarvon will communicate the result of this enquiry as soon as known to himself.
I have, &c. (Signed) T. FREDERICK ELLIOT.
The Hon. C. Tupper, The Hon. S. L. Tilley."
On the 17th of September this letter was received :
"Downing Street, 17th Sept., 1866.
"GENTLEMEN,— With reference to my letter of the 12th instant, I am directed by the Earl of Carnarvon to acquaint you that his Lordship has received a telegram from Lord Monck, to the effect, that in the present state of the Fenian affairs, the principal members of the Ministry, who must be Delegates, could not leave the Province, and probably not before the closing of the navigation.
"Lord Carnarvon regrets the occurrence of these unforeseen delays, which must entail so much inconvenience upon you and your colleagues, both in your public and private capacity, and he is most anxious to help you, as far as is in his power, to meet the difficulties of th present turn of affairs. It will, probably be your wish to deliberate amongst yourselves as to your joint course of action, having done which, his Lordship will be happy to confer with you, and to give you his best co-operation.
I have, &c. (Signed) T. FREDERICK ELLIOT.
The Hon. C. Tupper, The Hon. S. L. Tilley.
The following reply was sent to Mr. Elliot on the 22nd of September:
Alexandra Hotel, 22nd Sept., 1866.
"SIR,— We have the honor to acknowledge the receipt of your letters of the 12th and 17th instant, and thank Lord Carnarvon for the prompt manner in which his Lordship acceded to our request relating to the Communication with His Excellency the Governor General, and the desire exhibited to aid us in the circumstances in which we are placed by the delay on the part of the Delegates from Canada.
"Having had an opportunity of discussing the subject, the Delegates from Nova Scotia and New Brunswick will be glad to be honored with an interview at Lord Carnarvon's convenience.
We have, &c., (Signed) CHARLES TUPPER, S. L. TILLEY.
T. Frederick Elliot, Esq."
On the same day this answer was received :
"Downing Street, Sept. 22nd, 1866.
"GENTLEMEN,—In answer to your letter of this day's date, I am directed by the Earl of Carnarvon to acquaint you that his Lordship will be happy to receive the Delegates from Nova Scotia and New Brunswick, at this Office, on Monday, at one o'clock, if that time will suit their convenience.
I have, &c., (Signed) T. FREDERICK ELLIOT.
The Hon. C. Tupper, The Hon. S. L. Tilley."
To this letter the following reply was sent :
"Alexandra Hotel, 22nd Sept., 1866.
"SIR,— In reply to your letter of this day's date, we beg to day that the Delegates from Nova Scotia and New Brunswick will do themselves the honor of waiting upon his Lordship the Earl of Carnarvon, at one o'clock, on Monday next, as intimated by you.
We have, &c., (Signed) CHARLES TUPPER, S. L. TILLEY.
T. Frederick Elliot, Esq."
The Delegates from Nova Scotia and New Brunswick, after much consultation and mature deliberation, having decided to ask further pecuniary advantages for 194 DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1867.  the Provinces they represented, arrived at the conclusion that, if successful, similar advantages might be reasonably extended to Prince Edward Island, and therefore a further effort should be made to include Prince Edward Island to enter the Confederation, agreed to the following proposition:
"At a Meeting of the Delegates from Nova Scotia and New Brunswick, held at the Alexandra Hotel, London, on the 22nd day of September, 1866, all being present except the Honorable Mr. Wilmot, it was unanimously resolved, that inasmuch as the co-operation of Prince Edward Island, though not indispensable to a Union of the other British North American Provinces, is on many accounts very desirable, and as the settlement of the Land question, which has so long and so injuriously agitated that Colony, would be attended with great benefit, and at the same time place the Local Government of the Island, by the possession of the Proprietary lands, more on a footing with other Provinces, which have Crown Lands and Minerals as a source of local Revenue; therefore
"Resolved, That in case the Legislature of the Island should authorise the appointment of Delegates to act in conjunction with those from the other Provinces, is arranging a plan of cooperation- prior to the meeting of the Imperial Parliament, the Delegates from Nova Scotia and New Brunswick are hereby pledged to support the policy of providing such an amount as may be necessary for the purchase of teh proprietary rights, but not to exceed eight hundred thousand dollars, ($800,000.")
(Signed)  CHARLES TUPPER,  S.L. TILLEY
On Monday, the 24th September, a lengthened interview took place between the Delegates and the Secretary of State for the Colonies and Sir Frederick Rogers, when the foregoing Document was handed to Lord Carnarvon, with a request that he would forward it to the Governor General of CAnada, and the Lieutenant Governor of Prince Edward Island. His Lordship was also informed that the Delegates from Nova Scotia and New Brunswick, with the exception of Messrs. Chandler and MacFarlane, who were obliged to return home on account of urgent private business, would remain and await the arrival of the Canadian Delegates.
On the 18th of October, the following letter was received from Sir Frederick Rogers:
"Downing Street, 18th Oct., 1866.
"GENTLEMEN, - I am directed by the Earl of Carnarvon to acquaint you that his Lordship has received a Despatch from Viscount Monck, stating that the Gentlemen selected as Canadian Delegates on the subject of Confederation, will leave Canada on the 7th November.
"They hope to assemble in this country about the 20th of that month.
I have, &c., (Signed) FREDERICK ROGERS.
The Hon. C. Tupper, The hon. S. L. Tilley."
The Delegates from Canada having arrived, the Conference on the Union of the Colonies was duly organized at the Westminster Palace Hotel on the 4th of December. The Conference was composed as follows:
Hon. J.A. Macdonald, " G.E. Cartier, " W.P. Howland " W.M. McDougall, " H. Langevin, " A.T. Galt, (Canada);
Hon. Charles Tupper, " W.A. Henry, " J.W. Richie, " Jon. McGully, " A.G. Archibald, (Nova Scotia);
Hon. Peter Mitchell, " S.L. Tilley, " R.D. Wilmot, " Charles Fisher, " J. Johnson, (New Brunswick).
On motion of the Hon. C. Tupper, seconded by the Hon. S. L. Tilley, the Hon. J. A. McDonald was appointed Chairman; H. Bernard, Esquire, was appointed Secretary.
The Conference continued in session de die in diemuntil the 24th December, when the following Resolutions were finally agreed upon, and transmitted to the Secretary of State for the Colonies:

RESOLUTIONS

Adopted at a Conference of Delegates from the Provinces of Canada, Nova Scotia, and New Brunswick, held at the Westminster Palace Hotel, London, December 24th 1866.
1. The best interests and present and future prosperity of British North America will be promoted by a Federal Union under the Crown of Great Britain, provided such Union can be effected on principles just to the several Provinces.
2. In the Confederation of teh British North American Provinces, the system of Government best adapted under existing circumstances to protect the diversified interests of the several Provinces, and secure efficiency, harmony and permanency of the working of the Union, is a General Government charged with matters of common interest to the whole country, and Local Governments for each of the Canadas, and for the Provinces of Nova Scotia and New Brunswick, charged with the control of local matters in their respective sections, provision being made for the admission into the Confederation, on equitable terms, of Newfoundland, Prince Edward Island, the North West Territory, and British Columbia.
3. In framing a Constitution for the General Government, the Conference, with a view to the perpetuation of the connexion with the Mother Country, and the promotion of the best interests of the people of these Provinces, desire to follow the model of the British Constitution so far as circumstances will permit.
4. The Executive Authority or Government shall be vested in the Sovereign of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland, and be administered according to the well understood principles of the British Constitution, by the Sovereign personally, or by the Representative of the Sovereign duly authorized.
5. The Sovereign shall be Commander in Chief of the Land and Naval Militia Forces.
6. There shall be a General Legislature or Parliament for the Confederation, composed of the Sovereign, a Legislative Council, and a House of Commons.
7. For the purpose of forming the Legislative Council, the Confederation shall be considered as consisting of three Divisions: 1st, Upper Canada, 2nd, Lower Canada; and 3rd, Nova Scotia and New Brunswick; each division with an equal Representation in the Legislative Council.
8. Upper Canada shall be represented in the Legislative Council by 24 Members; Lower Canada by 24 Members; and the Maritime Provinces by 24 Members, of which Nova Scotia shall have 12 and New Brunswick 12 Members.
9. The Colony of Prince Edward Island, when admitted into the Confederation, shall be entitled to a Representatation of four Members in the Legislatuve Council. But in such case the Members allotted to Nova Scotia and New Brunswick shall be diminished to 10 each, such diminution to take place in each Province as vacancies occur.
10. The Colony of Newfoundland, when admitted into the Confederation, shall be entitled to a Representation in the Legislative Council of four Members.
11. The North West Territory and British Columbia shall be admitted into the Union on such terms and conditions as the Parliament of the Confederation shall deem equitable, and as shall receive the assent of the Sovereign; and in case of the Province of British Columbia, as shall be agreed to by the Legislature of such Province.
12. The Members of the Legislative Council shall be appointed by the Crown, under the Great Seal of the General Government from among residents of the Province for which they are severally appionted, and shall hold office during life. If any Legislative Councillor shall, for two consecutive Sessions of Parliament fail to give his attendance in the said Council, hi seat shall thereby become vacant.  
13. The Members of the Legislative Council shall be British subjects by birth or naturalization, of full age of thirty years; shall each possess in the Province for which they are appoint DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1867. 136 ed a continuous real property qualification of four thousand dollars over and above all incumbrances, and shall be and continue worth that sum over and above their debts and liabilities, and shall possess for which they are appointed, except in the case of persons holding positions which require their attendance at the Seat of Government pending their tenure of office.
14. If any question shall arise as to the qualification of a Legislative Councillor, the same shall be determined by the Legislative Council
15. The Members of the Legislative Council for the Confederation shall, in the first instance, be appointed upon the nomination of the Executive Governments of Canada, Nova Scotia, and New Brunswick, respectively, and the number allotted to each Provinces, due regard being had to the Local Council, so nominated, shall decline to accept it, it shall be competent for the Executive Government, in any Province, to nominate in his place a person who is not a Member of the Local Council.
16. The Speaker of the Legislative Council (unless otherwise provided by Parliament) shall be appointed by the Crown from among the Members of the Legislative Council, and shall hold office during pleasure, and shall only be entitled to a casting vote on an equality of votes.
17. Each of the twenty four Legislative Councillors, representing Lower Canada, in the Legislative Council of the General Legislature, shall be appointed to represent one of the twenty four Electoral Divisions mentioned in Schedule A of Chapter 1 of the Consolidated Statutes of Canada, and such Councillor shall reside or possess his qualification in the Division be is appointed to represent.
18. The basis of representation in the House of Commons shall be population as determined by the official Census every ten years, and the number of Members at first shall be one hundred and eighty one, distributed as follows:
Upper Canada, 82.
Lower Canda, 65.
Nova Scotia, 19.
New Brunswick, 15.
19. Until the first General Election niter the official Census of 1871 has been made up, there shall be no change in the number of Representatives from the several sections.
20. Immediately after the completion of the Census of 1871, and immediatley after every decennial Census thereafter, the representation from each Province in the House of Commons shall be readjusted on the basis of population, such re-adjustment to take effect on the termination of the then existing Parliament.
21. For the purpose of such re-adjustment, Lower Canada shall always be assigned sixty-five Members, and each of the other Provinces shall, at each re-adjustment, receive for the next ten years then next succeeding the number of Members to which it will be entitled on the same ratio of representation to population, as Lower Canada will enjoy according to the Census then last taken by having sixty five Members.
22. No reduction shall be made in the number of Members returned by any Province un;ess its popultion shall have decreased relatively to the population of the whole Union, to the extent of five per centum
23. In computing at each decennial period the number of Members to which each Province is entitled, no fractional parts shall be considered, unless when exceeding one half the number entitling to a Member, in which case a Member shall be given for each such fractional part.
24. The number of Members may at any time be increased by the General Parliament, regard being had to the proportionate rights then existing.
25. Until provisions are made by the General Parliament, all the Laws which at the date of the Proclamation constituting the Union are in force in the Province respectively, relating to the qualification and disqualification of any person to be elected, or to sit or vote as a Member of the Assembly in the said Province respectively, and relating to the qualification or disqualification of voters, and to the oaths to be taken by voters, and to the Returning Officers, and their powers and duties; and relating to the proceedings at Elections, and to the period during which sueh Elections may be continued; and relating to the trial of Controverted Elections, and the proceedings incident thereto; and relating to the vacating of seats of Members, and to the issuing and execution of new Writs in case of any seat being vacated otherwise than by a dissolution, shall respectively apply to Elections of Members to serve in the House of Commons for places situate in those Provinces respectively.
26. Every House of Commons shall continue for five years from the day of the return of the Writs choosing the same, and no longer; subject, never theless, to be sooner prorogued or dissolved by the Governor General.
27. There shall be a Session of the General Parliament once at least in every year, so that a period of twelve calender months shall not intervene between the last sitting of the General Parliament in one Session and the first sitting thereof in the next Session.
28. The General Parliament shall have power to make Laws for the peace, welfare and good government of the Confederation, (saving the Sovereignty of England,) and especially Laws respecting the following subjects.
1. The Public Debt and Property.
2. The regulation of Trade and Commerce.
3.The raising of Money by all or any mode or system of taxation.
4. The borrowing of Money on the Public Credit.
5. Postal Service.
6. Lines of Steam and other Ships, Railways, Canals, and other works connecting any two or more of the Provinces together, or extending beyond the limits of any Province.
7. Lines of Steamships between the Confederated Provinces and other Countries.
8. Telegarphic communications and the incorporation of Telegraph Companies.
9. All such works as shall, although lying wholly within any Province. be specially declared by the Acts authorizing them to be for the general advantage.
10. The Census and Statisitcs.
11. Militia, Military and Naval Service, and Defence.
12.Beacons, Buoys, Light Houses, and Sable Island.
13. Navigation and Shipping.
14. Quarantine.
15. Sea Coast and InlandFisheries.
16. Ferries between any Province and a Foreign Country, or between any two Provinces.
17. Currency and Coinage.
18. Banking, incorporation of Banks, and the issue of Paper Money.
19. Savings Banks.
20. Weights and Measures.
21. Bills of Exchange and Promissory Notes
22. Interest.
23. Legal Tender.
24. Bankruptcy and Insolvency.
25. Patents of Invention and Discovery.
26.Copyrights.
27.Imdians, and Lands reserved for Indians
28. Naturalization and Aliens
29. Marriage and Divorce
30. The Criminal Law, excepting the Constitution of Courts of Criminal Jurisdiction, but including the procedure in criminal matters.
31. The establishment, maintenance and management of Penitentiaries.
32. Rendering uniform all or any of the Laws relative to propery and civil rights in Upper Canada, Nova Scotia and New Brunswick,and rendering uniform the procedure of all or any of the Courts in these Provinces; but any Statute for this purpose shall have no force or authority in any Province until sanctioned by 196 DEBATES IN THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1866 two Ridings to be called respectively the South and North Ridings:
81. The South Riding to consist of the Townships of McNab, Baget, Blithfield, Brougham, Horton, Admaston, Graftan, Mattawachan, Griffith, Lyndock, Raglan, Radcliffe, Brudenell, Sebatopol, and the Villages of Araprior and Renfrew.
82. The North Riding to consist of the Townships of [?]

THE SECOND SCHEDULE

[?]

THE THIRD SCHEDULE.

Provincial Public Works and Peroperty to be the Property of Canada.
1. Canals, with land and water power connected therewith.
2. Public Harbors
3. Light Houses and Piers, and Sable Island.
4. Steamboats, Dredges, and Public Vessels.
5. Rivers and Lake improvements.
6. Railways and Railway Stocks, Mort gages and other Debts due by Railway Companies.
7. Military Roads.
8. Custom Houses, Post OFfices, and all other Public Buildings, except such as the Government of Canada appropriates for the use of the Provincial Legislatures and Governments.
9. Property transferred by the Imperial Government, and known as Ordnance Property.
10. Armories, Drill Sheds, Military Clothing, and Munitions of War, and Lands set apart for general public purposes.

THE FORTH SCHEDULE.

Assets to be the Property of Ontario and Quebec conjointly.
Upper Canada Building Fund. Lunatic Asylums. Normal School. Court Houses in Aylmer, Montreal Kamanaska -- Lower Canada. Law Society, UPper Canada, Montreal Turnpike Trust, University Permanent Fund. Royal Institution. Consolidated Municipal Loan Fund, Upper Canada. Consolidated Municipal Loan Fund, Lower Canada. Agricultural Society, Upper Canada. Lower Canada Legislative Grant. Quebec Fire Loan. [blurred text] Advance Account. Quebec Turnpike Trust. Education Trust. Building and Jury Fund, Lower Canada. [?]

THE FIFTH SCHEDULE.

[?]
[...] (as the case may be). in the Province of Nova Scotia, (or as the case may be), of the value of four thousand dollars over and above all Rents, Dues, Debts, Mortgages, Charges and Incumbrances, due or payable out of or charged on or affecting the same, and that I have not collusively or coloerable obtained a title to or became possessed of the said Lands and Tenements, or any part thereof, for the purpose of enabling me to become a Member of the Senate of Canada, (or as the case may be), and that mu Real and Personal Property are together worth four thousand dollars over and above my Debts and Liabilities.

INTER-COLONIAL RAILWAY.

On the 29th JAnuary, the following Memorandum was placed in the hands of Lord Carnarvon.
In December 1862, the Delegates from the several Provinces proposed to Her Majesty's Government that the Imperial guarantees should be given on the following conditions, viz: -
1. "That the Loan shall be for £3,000,000 Sterling.
2. "That the liabilities of each Colony shall be appointed as follows - £1, 250,000 for Canada; £875,000 for New Brunswick; £875,000 for Nova Scotia.
3. "The Debentures shall bear interest at the rate of 3 1/2 percent.
4. The Interest shall be paid half- early in London on the first of May and on the first of November.
5. "That the sum borrowed shall be repaid in four instalments - £250,000 in ten years; £500,000 in twenty years; £1,000,000 in thirty years; £1, 250,000 in forty years.
6. "The net profits of the Road shall be applied towards the extinction of the Debt.
7. "That the Loan shall be the first [?]
[?]
12. "That all not gained or lost resulting from the working and keeping in repairs of any portion of the Road constructed by Nova Scotia and New Brunswick, and to be [?] as a part of the Inter-Colonial Road, shall be [?] and borne by these Provinces respectively, and the surplus, if any, after the payment of Interest, shall go in abatement of Interest of the [blurred text] line between Halifax and River du Loup.
13. "That the rates shall be uniform over each respective portion of the Road.
14. "That Crown Lands required for the Railway or Stations shall be provided for each Province."
The following proposition was made on the part of Her Majesty's Government: -
1. "That Bills shall be immediately submitted to the Legislatures of Canada, Nova Scotia, and New Brunswick, authorising the respective Governments to borrow £3,000,000 under the guarantee of the British Government, in the following proportions: -- five twelfths, Canada; three and one half twelfths, Nova Scotia; three and one half twelfths, New Brunswick.
2. " But no such loan to be contracted on behalf of any one Colony until corresponding powers have been given to the Governments of the other two Colonies concerned, nor unless the Imperial Government shall guarantee payment of Interest on such Loan until repaid.
DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1867  209
3. "The money to be applied to the completion of a Railway connecting Halifax with Quebec, on a line to be approved by the Imperial Government.
4. "The Interest to be a first charge on the Consolidated Revenue Funds of the different Provinces after the Civil List, and the interest of existing debts; and as regards Canada, after the rest of the six charges [?]
5. [?] £1,000,000 to be payable thirty years after contracting Loan. £1,250,000 to be payable forty years after contracting Loan.
[?] first decade from the contracting of the Loan.
"2nd Decade, say 1873 to 1882 inclusive, a Sinking Fund of £40,000 to be remitted annually, being an amount adequate, if invested at five per cent. compound interest, to provide £500,000 at the end of the decade; the sum to be remitted annually to be invested in the names of Trustees, in Colonial Securities of any of the three Provinces prior to or forming part of the Loan now to be raised, or in such other Colonial Securities as Her Majesty's Government approve.
"3rd Decade, say 1883 to 1892 inclusive, a Sinking Fund of £80,000 to be remitted annually, being an amount adequate, if invested at five per cent. compound interest, to provide £1,000,000 at the end of the decade. The amount, when remitted, to be invested as in the case of the Sinking Fund for the preceding decade.
"4th Decade, say 1893 to 1902 inclusive, a Sinking Fund of £100,000 to be remitted annually, being an amount adequate, if invested at five per cent. compound interest, to provide £1,250,000, being the balance of the Loan, at the end of the decade. This amount, when remitted, to be invested as in the preceding decade.
"Should the Sinking Fund of any decade produce a surplus, it will go to the credit of the next decade, and in the last decade the Sinking Fund will be remitted or reduced accordingly.
"It is of course understood that the assent of the treasury to these arrangements presupposes adequate proof of the sufficiency of the Colonial Revenues to meet the charges intended to be imposed upon them.
6. "The construction of the Railway to be [?]
7.[?]
8. "Fitting provision to be made for [?]
9. Parliament not to be asked for [?]
This proposal was [?] by Nova Scotia and New Brunswick, but objected to be Canada.
By the Despatch of Mr. Cardwall, dated the 17th June, 1864, the engagement of Her Majesty's Government to grant the guarantee was renewed, but consideration of the terms was postponed for the future arrangement.
In consequence of the proposed Confederation of the Provinces, many of the clauses in both these propositions appear to be no longer required, and it is submitted that the terms of the Canada Guarantee Act of 1842 should be in the main followed. The Delegates therefore propose to Her Majesty's Government -
1st. "That a loan of £3,000,000 sterling, be negotiated with the guarantee of Imperial Parliament, the proceeds to be applied to the construction of the Inter-Colonial Railway.
2d. "The rate of interest to be four per cent. payable half-yearly, and both principal and interest to form the first charge upon the Revenue of the Confederation after existing debts and charges.
3d. "A Sinking Fund at the rate of one per cent. per annum to be provided by the Confederation, to be invested in the securities of the Confederation existing prior to the guaranteed loan, or in such other securities as may be suggested by the Confederation, and approved by Her Majesty's Government."
The Trustees of the Sinking Fund to consist of one officer to be appointed by the Imperial Government, and an other by the Government of Confederation.
(Signed) JOHN A. MACDONALD, Chairman.
London, 28th January 1967.
On the 12th of February, a Deputation of the Conference, consisting of Messrs. Galt, Howland, Tupper, and Tilley, waited by invitation upon the Right Hon. the Chancellor of the Exchequer and explained fully the [?] ing the details connected therewith. [?] placed the following Memorandum in the hands of the Chancellor of the Exchequer.-
[?]
Revenue
Canadas, ..  .. $23, 472, 740
Nova Scotia, ..  .. 1, 665, 071
New Brunswick, ..  .. 1, 272, 021
$15, 309, 840
Expenditure.
Canada, $11, 711, 320
Nova Scotia (ab't) 1, 600,000
New Brunswick 1, 080,047
$14, 391, 367
Surplus, .. .. $918,473
N.B. - Militia Expenditure last year.
Canada, .. $1, 688, 868
Nova Scotia 156, 460
New Brunswick 152, 148
$1, 947, 476
Public Debt of "Canada" will be -
Ontario and Quebec, $62, 500,000
Nova Scotia 8, 000,000
New Brunswick 7,000,000
$77, 500,000
Charges on Public Debt last year.
Canada, $3, 692, 412
Nova Scotia, 297, 580
New Brunswick 349, 283
$4, 339, 275
After Union will be about $4, 350, 000
Trade and Shipping.
IMPORTS, Total. From Gt. Bri'n 
Canada $48,610,477 $28,984,599
Nova Scotia, 14,381,662 6,315,988
New Brunswick 7,086,591 2,284,449
$70,078,734 $37,585,036
210 DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1867
*EXPORTS
Canada, $53,930,789 $12, 766,668
Nova Scotia, 8,830,693 765,472
New Brunswick, 5,534,726 2,594,651
$68,296,208 $16,125,791
* Exclusive of Coin and Bullion.
Tonnage.
ENTRIES—INWARDS. TONS.
Canada, .. .. .. 938,946
Nova Scotia, .. .. 929,929
New Brunswick, . .. 807,161
2,676,036
OUTWARDS,
Canada, 1,113,386
Nova Scotia, 772,017
New Brunswick, 754,876
2,540,279
Tons, .. 5,316,315
SHIPPING OWNED IN
Canada, 230,429
Nova Scotia, 403,409
New Brunswick, 309,695
Tons, .. .. 948,683

A BILL

For authorising a Guarantee of Interest on a Loan to be raised by Canada towards the construction of a Railway connecting Quebec and Halifax.
Whereas the construction of a Railway, connecting the Port of Riviere du Loup in the Province of Quebec, with the line of Railway leading from the City of Halifax, in the Province of Nova Scotia, at or near the Town of Truro, in a line and on conditions approved by one of Her Majesty's Principal Secretaries of State, would conduce to the welfare of Canada, and promote the interests of the British Empire: And whereas it would greatly facilitate the construction of that Railway (in this Act referred to as the Railway,) if payment of interest on part of the money required to be raised for the same, were guaranteed under the authority of Parliament ;—
Be it therefore enacted by the Queen's Most Excellent Majesty, by and with the advice and consent of the Lords Spiritual and Temporal, and Commons, in this present Parliament assembled, and by the authority of the same, as follow: —
1. Subject to the provisions of this Act, the Commissioners of Her Majesty's Treasury in guarantee, in such manner and form as they think fit, payment of interest at a rate not exceeding four per centum per annum on any principal money not exceeding the sum of Three Million Pounds Sterling,. to be raised by way of Loan by the Government of Canada, for the purpose of the construction of the Railway ; and the Commissioners of Her Majesty's Treasury may from time to time cause to be issued out of the Consolidated Fund of the United Kingdom, or the growing produce thereof, any money required for giving effect to such guaantee.
2. The Commissioners of Her Majesty's Treasury shall not give any guarantee under this Act unless and until an Act of the Parliament of Canada has been passed, within two years after the union of Canada under the British North American Act, 1867, providing, to the satisfaction of one of Her Majesty's Principal Secretaries of Sate, as follows: —
1. For the construction of the Railway ;
2. For the use of the Railway at all times for her Majesty's Military and other services ; nor unless and until the line in which the Railway is to be constructed has been approved by one of Her Majesty's Principal Secretaries of State.
3. The Commissioners of Her Majes- Treasury shall not give any guarantee under this Act unless and until an Act of Parliament of Canada has been passed, providing, to the satisfaction of the Commissioners of Her Majesty's Treasury, as follows :—
1. For the raising, appropriation, and expenditure for the purpose of the construction of the Railway, of a Loan not exceeding Three Million Pounds Sterling, bearing interest at a rate not exceeding four per centum per annum :
2. For charging the Consolidated Revenue Fund of Canada with the principal and interest of the Loan immediately after the charges specifically made thereon by the British North American Act, 1867 :
3. For the payment by the Government of Canada, by way of Sinking Fund, of an annual sum at the rate of one per centum per annum on the entire amount of principal money whereon interest is guaranteed, to be remitted to the Commissioners of Her Majesty's Treasury, by equal half- yearly payments, in such manner as they from time to time direct, and to be invested and accumulated under their direction in the names of four Trustees, nominated from time to time, two by the Comis sioners of Her Majesty's Treasury, and two by the Government of Canada ; such Sinking Fund and its accumulations to be applied under the direction of the Commissioners of Her Majesty's Treasury in discharge of principal money whereon interest is guaranteed :
6. For continuance of the Sinking Fund until all principal and interest of the loan, and all sums issued out of the Consolidated Fund of the United Kingdom under this Act, ad all interest thereon, are fully discharged, or until the Sink- sing Fund and Its accumulations are adequate to discharge so much thereof as remains undischarged :
7. For the raising by the Government of Canada (without guarantee by the Commissioners of Her Majesty's Treasury) of all such money (if any) beyond the sum of Three Million Pounds Sterling, as, in the opinion of one one of her Majesty's Principal Secretaries of State, will be requisite for the construction of the Railway, and for charging the Consolidated Revenue Fund of Canada with the money so raised, and interest, immediately after the charges made thereon, in pursuance of the foregoing provisions of this section.
4. There shall be laid before both Houses of Parliament, within fourteen days next after the beginning of every Session, a statement and account showing what has been done from time to time in execution or pursuance of this Act, by or under the direction of the Commissioners of Her Majesty's Treasury, and one of Her Majesty's Principal Secretaries of State, and the Parliament and Government of Canada.
5. This Act may be cited as " The Canada Railway Loan Act, 1867."
After several protracted negotiations with the Secretary of Stae for the Colonies, and gentlemen connected with the Treasury Department, and furnishing 211 DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1867 description, Her Majesty's Government agreed to ask Parliament for a guarantee of Three Millions Sterling, to build the Inter-Colonial Railway.
Considerable difficulty arose with regard to the investment of the Sinking Fund, and the legislation required by Canada previous to the attaching of the guarantee. The Treasury Department required that Canada should provide by special law for raising the necessary Revenue to defray the Interest on the Loan before any guarantee should be made, and that the Sinking Fund should be invested in British funds. After a series of interviews they were induced to abandon their first condition as to proof of the Revenue required to meet the Loan, and also to agree to the proposal of the Delegates, that the Sinking Fund should be invested in Colonial or other Securities at the option of Canada.
We cannot close this Report without expressing our obligations to the Right Honorable the Earl of Carnarvon for the interest he evinced on our behalf, and for the patient manner in which he discussed the different questions that were raised during the progress of our deliberations, and for his energy and persever- ance in carrying the Act of Union through the House of Lords, and to the Duke of Buckingham and Chandos for the hearty manner in which he entered into the question of guarantee, and for his strenuous exertions to induce the Treasury Department to accede to the proposition we made for securing the money, and for successfully carrying the Bill for the guarantee through the House of Lords; and to the Right Honorable Mr. Adderley for the ability he displayed in carrying the Act of Union and the guarantee through the House of Commons.
We also desire to express our great obligations to the Right Honorable Edward Cardwell, and to the Right Honorable Mr. Gladstone, Mr. Watkins, and other Members of the opposition, for the cheerful and efficient aid they rendered in carrying the measure.
P. MITCHELL, S. L. TILLEY, CHARLES FISHER, ROBT. D. WILMOT, E. B. CHANDLER, J. M. JOHNSON.
To His Excellency Major General C. HAS- TINGS DOYLE, Administrator of the Government, &c., &c., &c.

Source:

New Brunswick. Reports of the Debates of the House of Assembly. St. John: G.W. Day, 1865-1867. Microfilm copies provided by the Provincial Archives of New Brunswick.

Credits:

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Selection of input documents and completion of metadata: Gordon Lyall.

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