20 DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1866.
HON. MR. FISHER'S RESOLUTION ON THE
APPOINTMENT OF DELEGATES TO MAKE
ARRANGEMENTS FOR THE UNION OF
BRITISH NORTH AMERICA.
Hon. Mr. FISHER.—In bringing a
resolution before the House I have
generally found it necessary to offer
some arguments why it should pass, but
I feel on this occasion that very few
observations are required. I do not
feel disposed, at this hurried season of
the year, to occupy the time of the
House to convince them of what they
are already convinced of, for this is not
a new proposition. When we reflect
upon the history of the past, we all
know that this question has been discussed by the people of the country in
all its bearings, and their representatives come here charged with their
opinion upon this question. I do not
intend to occupy the time of the House
beyond two or three minutes. We
know that the question of the Union of
British North America has been in the
minds of the people of this country for
twenty-five or thirty years. About
three years ago propositions were made
for the Provinces to discuss this question, and a Scheme of Union was
agreed upon. The Legislature of Ca
nada, in both its departments, have
passed upon this question, and it has
been discussed in this Province. The
general election has been held in order
to test the minds of the people of the
country upon the Union of British
North America. I think it is gratifying
to all of us that the people of this Province were so unanimous upon this
question as they really were. The proposition which I have to make now is
in the resolution, and I know that a
large majority of the people are in
favor of the measure. The Government are anxious that past differences
should be forgotten. Much political
strife and bitterness will arise in deciding a question of this kind, but we
hope the result we have arrived at will
advance the interest of all. The basis
of any arrangement for the Union of
these Provinces will be the Resolutions
adopted at Quebec. That matter has
been discussed throughout the Provinces, and objections have been made
to different portions of it. What we
propose to do is, to get as many improvements made to it as we possibly
can. This resolution proposes that we
should ask the Governor appoint
Delegates to unite with Delegates from
the other Provinces in arranging with
the Imperial Government for the Union
of British North America upon such
terms as will secure the just rights and
interests of New Brunswick, accompanied with provision for the immediate
construction of the Inter-Colonial Railway—each Province to have an equal
voice in such Delegation, Upper and
Lower Canada to be considered as
seperate Provinces. There are two
principles in the resolutions adopted at
Quebec, about which there will be very
little discussion, that is the principle of
Federation and the principle of representation by population. The finance
arrangements, and the arrangements
regarding the Legislative Council will
be considered, and upon these points
it will be the endeavor of the Government to secure as favorable terms as
they possibly can. Another proposition
in this resolution is, that not only our
just rights and interests are to be secured, but there is a provision for the
immediate construction of the InterColonial Railway. This proposition is
conveyed in as strong language as can
be written, and it lies at the bottom and
forms the basis of any arrangement
that may be made. I am not going to
occupy the time dilating upon the advantages of Union. If we want arguments in favor
of Union let us look at
the neighboring country, and see the
blood and treasure which they have spent in preserving their Union. Here
we are in a sort of transition state ; we
are now about to make arrangements to
form a Union of the different North
American Provinces under the care of
the British Government. We are going
to develop our national resources, consolidate our varied interests, and
secure measures for our common
and mutual defence. The country
have declared themselves unmistakably in favor of Union, and it is our wish
and determination to meet the objections of the smallest minority in every
way in order that when this Union is
consummated it will not only provide
the greatest good for the greatest number, but that the smallest number will
have no reason to complain.
Mr. SMITH—I suppose it is expected
that I will make some observations. I
believe I express the feeling of every
hon. member on the floors of the House,
and every man throughout the country,
when he comes to know of the speech
of the hon. mover of the Resolution on
a subject so important, when I say I
expected a more detailed explanation,
of the policy of the Government. The
object is to conceal what the Government intend to do. While I am prepared to admit
that the people of the country have adopted the principle of Union,
it has been done by agencies with which
it is not necessary for me to deal. Fenianism is one of the agencies that has
acted upon the public mind, and it has
also been acted upon by the treacherous
unconstitutional conduct of the Governor. By these means the Government
have obtained a majority, and I bow, as
I have always done, to the will of the
people. I believe that unless this
Scheme of Confederation is accomplished in a short time, the reaction upon
this Scheme will be more powerful than
it ever has been. Public opinion is very
uncertain. I see many of my hon. friends
here with whom I have sat side by side
and contested many a political battle,
but they have not been here continuously, but have been out and in according to the
fluctuations of public opinion.
I came here fourteen years ago, and I
only see one hon. member (Mr. Kerr)
who has been here continuously since
that period except myself This proves
the uncertainty of public opinion, and
we cannot tell what another election
may bring forth. As this question has
now been determined by the people, we
should endeavor, as far as practicable,
to obtain for this country every possible
confession promotive of its interest in
this Confederation. I believed from the
first that this Scheme was fraught with
peril, and I relaxed no effort on my
part to prevent its infliction upon the
country. I do not regret the course I
have taken, although my efforts have
been unavailing. It this Union is pro
DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1866. 21
ductive of good, I will share in it. If
on the other hand, it is productive of
evil. I shall be free from the responsibility of bringing it upon the country. I
ask hon. members whether they are
prepared to accept the Quebec Scheme.
I believe a large majority of the people of
the country are decidedly opposed to that
Scheme. but i believe as firmly as I believe I live that if power is given to Delegates
to act in conjunction with Delegates from the other Provinces, no material alterations
will be made in the
Scheme. it is a most extraordinary
thing that the Government, in moving a
resolution like this. will not condescend
to inform the country of the basis upon
which they intend to proceed. I believe
the reason' is because they know the
people of the country are opposed to
the Quebec scheme. This question will
affect this country for all time to come,
and it is important that hon. members
should bring their minds to consider
this question free from prejudice, and
not support a resolution for the more
purpose of victory. I ask erery hon.
member here if it was not the duty of
the Government to give some information of whatthey intend to do? Is it
enough to state that the Delegates will
endeavor to obtain better terms if they
can? Who will be the De egates that
are to be clothed with this tremendous power to settle and determine for
the people of this country what their
constitution shall be for all time to
come? Where, in the history of a
free country. can you find that such
powers have been given to any individuals to determine a Scheme of Union
so important and so tremendous in its
consequences as this must be to the
people ot' this country. without any reference to the Legislature or people?
Is it not right that any Scheme of Union to be
carried out and consummated by an Act of the Imperial Parliament. I may, he entirely
in error, and my judgement may be erroneous, but it does seem to me to be but reasonable
that the people of this country should have some voice in the
matter, because it hu net been said that
the people of the muffin have affirmed
the Quebec Scheme. I believe a large
portion of the country are opposed to the
Scheme in many ofita provisions and features. They have affirmned the principle
of Union without reference to the Quebec
Scheme, If then Delegates go home to
England and am. in conjunction with Delegates from the other Provinces, is it not
right that the people of this Province, who Â
are so seriouslyto be affected by it, should
have some voics'as to whether the Scheme
they had agreed upon was good or bad ?
Should they not have a right to pass
judgment'upon it? Therefore the Government have failed in the way in which
they have put the matter before the House.
l do not think they have treated the
House and people right. The Attorney
General does not say whether he' intends to have this matter referred to
the people, or whether he intends to
have those Delegate go to England
and there act with other Delegates in
forming a Scheme of Union which is to
be imported upon us by an Act of Imperial
Parliament. (Hon. Mr. Fisher. That is
the why it is to be done.) That then is
the power which is proposed to be given
to the Delegates. I am not going to discuss the way in which the Government
obtained power. but I believe it was by
unfair means. I think the Governor did
injustice to his late Council and to the
country in consulting with members of
he Opposition. When members of the
Government went to the Government
House to consult him. he left them and
consulted a member of the Opposition,
who was one of the most determined opponents oi the Government. These are
the means by which the present Government obtained power, and the people
have affirmed their position. They have
declared against me and my late colleagues; and we await future developments to show
whether we were right or
wrong. That the late Government were
not consuitcd'by the Governor is a fact
admitted on all sides, but he has been
sustained because the people were in a
state of political intoxication; but when
sober reason comes to exercise its away
this decision will be reversed ; but in the
meantime our constitution is gone. Hon.
members may treat it with leiity. and
think it a matter of little importance
whether a man be anti-Confderate or
Confederate, they ought not to think so
lightly of it ; pevery. member ought to be
impressed with the solemnity of this occasion, because it is a matter of infinite
importance. If it were a matter affecting
the country for but ten or twenty years,
we might treat it with comparative indiference, but it is binding upon us for
ever. It is the imperctive duty of every
men who has a sense of his reponsibility
to consider .this matter seriously, and not
loan himself to this or that man when his country is in danger. If any men are animated
by a desire for self-aggrandizement
in this matter, let me apply to them the
language of the poet—" Is there not some
chosen curse, some hidden thunder stirs
heaven red with uncommon wrath, to
blight the man who owes his greatness to
his country's ruin." It has flashed across
my mind that the judgement of some of these men may be blinded by the prospect of
a large arena where their ambition may be gratified. I see in this resolution some
protection, there is still a hope left. In
Nova Scotia the people have never passed
upon this question. If Confederation
should be carried and imposed upon
the people of that Province without their
being appealed to, a flagrant outrage will
have been perpetrated upon them. I have
more confidence inths British Government
any Act of Union can be passed without the
people of Nova Scotia being appealed to.
I have been told by Joseph Howe, who
is admitted to be the greatest statesman
in the, whole of America, that he saw
the elements of discord in this Union,
and he would not support it if they gave
him the Governorship of India. He
has fought the battles of the people and
obtained for them the recognition of all
their rights under the constitution under which they live. He has moved
Nova Scotia from its centre to its circumference. It has been promulgated
throughout the country that Joseph
Howe is imbecile or crazy. I have
heard speeches about his mental imbecility, but I should like to hear them
make one like I heard him make twelve
months ago at Detroit. Then he was
considered the pride of British America,
but now, because he would not drop into those Confederation grooves, he is
anathematizcd. abused, and contumely
heaped upon his head. It seems the
custom to abuse those who dare to raise
their voice in favor of the institutions
of their country. I have been most
fearfully abused throughout this contest, because I have had the hardihood
to stand up to preserve inviolate the institutions of the country. The Governor has
charged me, and he has charged
his late Council, with taking a paper
from the file. This was an unwarrantable charge, for we had no access to
the Council Chamber. He has put it torward over this country'that we were
guilty of felony. because he says we abstracted from the files of the Council a
paper which he says ought to have been
there. That charge was totally unfounded. lnstead of accepting our resignation in
the usual manner by asking us to retain office until our successors were appointed,
he accepted them
absolutely, and we ceased to be Executive Councillors. The paper was our
paper, and it never was in our Executive Council Chamber. The Governor
has charged me with telling untruths,
and these, with other slanders, have
gone forth to the country. He has appealed to his high name and lineage.
He says the name of Gordon was ever
a guarantee for truth. When a man is
22 DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1866.
driven to appeal to his name as an argument to show why he is right and his
adversary wrong, he must feel that his
case is weak. I will show how frail
his memory was. He said he addressed a
letter to me, and before handing it to
me, he put a date to it. The letter
bears no date at all ! That shows he is
liable to err. His memory has failed
him often and often in many material
points. I could say a great deal, but I
forbear. I wish to speak respectfully
of the representative of Her Majesty, but he is a man like ourselves, and we should
have fair play and justice
front him. In regard to this Delegation, I do not know when it is to be
sent, but from indications which I see
around, and from what I know of the necessities of Canada, I think it will not be
long before it goes. I know the Government of Canada cannot last long as
it is. The Legislature was not called
together. Why ? It was not called
tagether because Confederation was not
passed in this Province, and that Government was like a rope of sand unless Confederation
was carried. I speak, feeling
that my voice will be entirely powerless ;
still, I feel it my duty both to myself and
country, to express my views. I know
that the Legislature of Canada was postponed from time to time, and their Government
undertook to dictate to us when
our Legislature should meet. The necessity of Canada has given birth to the
whole scheme, and I can prove this by
her leading statesmen, Mr. McGee and
others. This measure did not emanate
from the British Government, but they
have approved of the Scheme, and are
committed to it.
When I examined this resolution to
appoint delegates, I found in it what, to
a certain extent, relieved my mind. I believe Prince Edward Island will not
come into this scheme of Union, neither
will Newfoundland. By the terms of
this resolution, the delegates, unless
met in London by other Delegates from
all these Provinces, will have no power
to make an arrangement. Unless this
delegation be full they have no power
to act. This is intended by the hon.
mover. It is not necessary to argue
that if you delegate men to act with
other men representing other interests,
their power ceases unless met by those
they were appointed to meet. This
Quebec Scheme was prepared upon the
assumption that all these Lower Provinces are to come in. It has been said
that the interests of these Lower Provinces are identical, and they would
unite for the protection of the interests
of the Maritime Provinces. If Prince
Edward Island and Newfoundland are
not embraced within this confederation,
the arguments are weakened and fail,
because the influence of the Maritime
Provinces is reduced to that extent. Therefore I am glad the Government have said
they are unwilling to go into confederation unless all the other Maritime Provinces
enter into Union at the same time. That is the only interpretation that can be put
upon the resolution. It is not necessary for me to argue that point, for any person
will understand that if an agent is appointed to act with other agents, that agent
can not act without the other agents acting with him. Unless the House restrain these
delegates when they proceed to England, we will have the Quebec Scheme upon us. No
doubt but it will be the authors of the scheme who will be sent, and these gentlemen
have declared that if they get a better scheme they will take it, if not they will
take the Quebec Scheme. As they have made this declaration before going there, do
you suppose the Canadian politicians will give them a better when they know they will
accept the present ? If you want to buy a farm you will not say to the owner, if you
will not take ÂŁ450 I will give you ÂŁ500. The delegates have been telling the people,
that under the Quebec Scheme the Lower Provinces have a decided advantage over the
Canadas, how then can our delegates ask for better terms than the terms which they
have said gave them such an advantage over the Canadas. If we are going to have confederation,
we should do everything we can to obtain a scheme that will be an advantage to the
Province and not a destruction to it. If this confederation is to be accomplished,
I shall move a resolu ion restraining the power of these delegates, which, I think,
will commend itself to the favorable consideration of a majority of the House. If
the desire of the Government is to obtain a good scheme of Union, they will not object
to receiving instruction from this House. If the delegates proceed to England with
these instructions given by this House, and the Canadians find that the delegates
have no power to consent to a Union, unless that scheme embraces certain provisions
necessary for the country, they, rather than not have confederation—for I know their
anxiety for it—will make those concessions. If our delegation goes home without those
instructions, you agree to the scheme, believing it to be a good scheme, and you need
not seek any amendment. Then, when this Union is brought about, how utterly this Parliament
will fade away. It will not be worthy of the best minds of our country to come here,
for this Assembly will dwindle down to a mere municipality. I trust I may be mistaken,
and that the
great interests of the country may be advanced ; but these are my views. I do not
believe there are ten men here who will not resign their seats at once if confederation
is carried. Whether I shall make any effort to go to Ottawa remains in the future.
It has been no advantage to me to be a member of this House, but, on the contrary,
it has been a pecuniary less. I have been a member of the House for fourteen years,
and one-half of that time has been given to the public for which I have practically
received nothing. There are others here who have given their time to the public without
receiving an equivalent. My hon. friend Mr. Kerr has never received a dollar ; what
object can he have in continuing a member of a Legislature which would have no more
to do than the corporation of the City of St. John. He would not remain here an hour.
I shall feel it necessary to express my views upon the action of the Legislative Council.
I predicted from the beginning that this scheme was prepared with all the elements
necessary to give it vitality. Out of the Legislative Council there are ten members
to go to Ottawa. We all have our ambitious feelings ; if fifteen of the members of
this House were to be provided with seats at Ottawa for life, do you not think it
would have an influence upon the vote of this House ? We know that personal interest
blinds the eyes and warps the judgment, and the person under its influence is not
conscious of it. There is no doubt but that the deliberations of the Legislative Council
have been influenced by the fact that ten of their number are to be appointed to seats
in the Legislative Council at Ottawa for life. That makes ten vacancies for ten hon.
members of this House, if those seats are worthy of their ambition. This is part of
the machinery to facilitate the passage of the Scheme through the Legislature. It
was agreed at the conference at Quebec that it was to be passed through the Legislature
without any appeal to the people. (Cries of no, no.) Whether there was a positive
agreement I know not, but there was an understanding that it was to be done if practicable.
(No ; no.) Why then have they attempted to do so in Nova Scotia ? Why did not they
proceed on the same principle there as here, instead of pressing it through the Legislature
without any appeal to the people at all ? Did they enter into an agreement different
from the line of action to be adopted by the Delegates
in this Province ? You would suppose they would act unitedly in the means and agencies
employed to work out their purpose. Therefore I consider that if they had thought
it possible to put that measure through our Legislature they would have done so. I
shall take the liberty
DEBATES OF THE HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY FOR 1866. 23
calling the attention of the House to several provisions in the Quebec Scheme, and state my objections to them ; whether it will
have any influence upon the Delegates I know not ; but first let us hear what are
the opinion of Canadian statesmen on this Scheme, and how far the people of this country
may expect concessions, and get better terms than those [?] the Scheme. Mr. D'Arcy M'Gee in describing the Scheme (Mr. Tilley, When) When the
Parliament of Canada approved of the Scheme, and asked Her Majesty to bring it into
effect by Imperial Legislation. (Mr. Smith then quoted from speeches delivered by
Messrs. D'Arcy McGee and John McDonald, to show the Scheme was unalterable.) We have
also the testimony of Mr. Brown, and Mr Galt that it cannot be altered. When Mr. Allan
and I were in England Mr. Cardwell intimated that some altera ions might take place.
We asked him could representation by population be altered ? No. Could the representation
in the Legislative Council be altered ? No. Could the provision of eighty cents per
head be altered ? No. Thus we found no material part of the Scheme could be changed,
and any delegation which goes home will have to accept the Quebec Scheme in its entirety,
unless they receive instructions from the people of the country. If they go there
clothed with restrictive power, which says you may go to a certain extent and no farther
; then, when the Canadian Delegates know that they cannot deviate from the letter
of their instructions, they may consent to some alterations.
The debate was then adjourned until to-morrow. Mr. Smith to resume at half- past nine.
The House then went into Committee on " A Bill relating to the administration of Justice
in Equity," which created some discussion, when progress was reported and leave asked
to sit again.
The House was then adjourned until 9 a. m. to-morrow.
T. P. D.
Fisher,
Charles
Wellington
