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WEDNESDAY, March 9.
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Debate on the Address resumed.
Hon. the SPEAKER said he was an
anti-confederate, had been one from the
first, and none of the arguments used
had in the least induced him to change
his opinion. He was sorry that since
last session the learned member for
Charlottetown had strayed from the
anti-confederate ranks, and whose able
support they had thereby lost ; but the
hon. member might have had good reason for changing his mind on this subject. He would
look for a moment at
the finance side of the question. We
were to receive £100,00, and for which
we were asked to give up the rights and
liberties of the peoples of this Island. He
would ask was much such a sum a sufficient
compensation for the liberties, rights,
privileges and revenues of this Colony ?
Our revenue this year was up to £90,000, and he did not doubt but then in
two years more it would reach £100,000.
If we became, or were now a part of the
Dominion, we would then have a uniform tariff. Ours now was but 11 per
cent, while that of the Dominion was 14
or 15 per cent. If our tariff had been as
high as that of the Dominion for the past
year, the revenue would have come up
to that figure. Out of union, as we now
were, with the tariff of this year, he felt
that, according to the increase of population, in two years our revenue would
be equal to the amount we would receive, and that in ten years it would
greatly exceed that amount. He would
like to know to whom would this increased revenue belong? Would Canada
put her hands into her own treasury and
pay that surplus over to us ? In consideration of the loss sustained by this
Colony in having been deprived of its
public lands, it was proposed to allow
us £200,000, which sum, if possible, was
to be obtained from the Imperial Government ; if not thus secured, Canada
proposed to give us the money herself,
but he doubted very much if she would
ever pay it. The amount of our indebtedness, £150,000, had been incurred for
a landable purpose. So much was this
the case, he had never heard any complaints from the people respecting it.
No, not even among those who were on
properties for which the Government
had been allowed to purchase at rates
which made it necessary to fix the price
higher than twelve or thirteen shillings
per acre which was the highest price
fixed by law for these lands. The country was improving from one end of the Island
to the other ; homesteads were being
erected, and the people were contented.
He could not, therefore, but conclude
that the purchasing of the lands had been
a benefit to the country. It was, he considered, the duty of the land office to see
that the lands
sold were paid for as the
instalments became due ; of the Government Surveyor to mark out and describe
lands that were to be disposed of, in the
different parts of the country, and of the
Government to use their efforts to have
them taken up and improved. By pursuing this course our debt would be
gradually wiped off, without the aid of
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Canadian money. He did not doubt but
that Great Britain desired this Colony to
unite with Canada, but did not believe
she would use force or compel us to do
so against our will. Under our constitution, every man had freedom of speech
and action, and as there were no more
loyal people under the British flag than
those of this colony, he had no fears that
coercive measures would ever be adopted.
Great Britain had no claims upon us.
We paid our civil list, were buying out
our lands, and had made provision for the
payment of the Lieutenant Governor's
salary. In this he thought we had acted
prematurely. We should have tested
the home government more fully on this
question. However, as we had now to
pay him, he thought we should have the
privilege of appointing that officer.
Having been thrown upon our own resources, we ought to be left to enjoy our
own opinions. This colony was small in
comparison with Canada, but, like those
of the New Dominion, we were an agricultural people, and their products were
similar to our own. Any market Canada could offer us were, like Halifax,
easily supplied. We had had markets
in England, Newfoundland, the West
Indies and the United States, but none
suited us so well as the latter. Since the
repeal of the reciprocity treaty in 1864,
we found the British market a good one.
He did not know but that we had done
as well since 1864 as we had from 1854
up to that time. In all the markets we
go to, except Canada, where our products were taken, there we could purchase our supplies.
In England we
should buy our goods, because they took
our products in return; while in the
Dominion if we bought goods, we had
to pay for them with the gold and silver
which was required for circulation among
ourselves. We were told that an inter- colonial free trade would spring up, but
how, he was at a loss to see. When the
despatches were laid upon the table the
question would be more fully considered,
meantime he would prefer to bear the
ills we have than, fly to those we knew
nothing of.
Dr. JENKINS, in rising to speak, did so
under a deep sense of responsibility, and
felt how unable he was to set the question before the public in its proper light.
He had always been in favor of confederation in the abstract, but opposed the
Quebec Scheme because he considered it
was unjust to this Island. He consider
ed it an important question, and thought
the committee should look at it from such
a stand point of view as would enable it
to see what its duty was. He thought
all would concede that our entering the
Dominion was a matter of indifference
to her people. Canada would scorn to
give us £200,000 to induce us to unite
with her. When confederation was first
mooted it was a matter of indifference to
Canada whether we joined them or not;
it was the same still. Canada, in this
matter, was merely the month-piece of
the mother country. The Dominion
counted their revenue by millions; we
counted ours by thousands. Our revenue
would be about the fortieth part of
theirs. He could not see that our
entering into confederation would be
the least advantage to Canada. The
reason the 800,000 dollars was offered
us, was simply because Great Britain
suggested that she should deal liberally
with the Island, and he could not see
that it was fair to say Canada would
take it out of us in another way, for the
Dominion could not tax us without taxing her own people. In many parts of
the Dominion they were already complaining, and even groaning under
their municipal taxes, and no doubt they
would resist any undue increase in their
tariff. He believed the holding of those
colonies was a source of weakness to
Great Britain, and the means through
which the United States caused her
much annoyance; and that if she should
even be forced to protect these North
American colonies against the United
States, it would cost an immense loss of
blood and treasure; and even then he
doubted it it could be successfully done.
Great Britain seemed to say to the colonies, "you have grown to your manhood. It is
dangerous for us to hold you
any longer; we will allow you to do for
yourselves." It was a step toward independence, and one that would eventually lead
to annexation. He did not
intend to enter minutely into the
financial part of the argument, but would
merely say that, assuming we were, by
the terms, to lose something, he thought
it unreasonable for this colony to suppose it would be allowed to resist the
Imperial policy. If we did not unite and
become a province of Canada, we would
be tacked on as a dependency of the
Dominion. It appeared to him that the
people had been struck with a panic,
and that the officers (he meant the govt.)
should have endeavored to rally and in
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spire them with new courage; instead of
thus acting, the officers in command told
the people to run from the imaginary
foe–confederation. He came in contact
frequently with the country people, had
a firm faith in their good sense and intelligence, and believed they were prepared
to deal with this question properly.
The present leaders of the people seemed
to think that by trimming their sails to
meet the popular breeze they would be
able to command the ship of state and
steer it into the harbor whither they
wished to go. But candor induced one
of the officers to admit last evening that
the probability was the popular breeze
would land him in the bosom of his own
family. The time he believed had arrived when public men would have to
take a stand upon this question. If we
refused fair terms, he was persuaded a
pressure would be brought to bear upon
us. He would prefer that Great Britain
should compensate us for the loss of our
public lands, but if this could not be
effected, he could see no valid reason for
refusing to accept payment from the Dominion. The idea that it would entail
disgrace upon us to accept the $800,000
was ridiculous.
Mr. HOWAT said the hon. member for
Charlottetown (Dr. Jenkins) seemed to
think the people had been struck with a
panic. It was not so, and the hon. member would find that the antis had as
much courage as himself; not could he
(Dr. Jenkins) prove his assertion. It
was the mature and deliberate opinion of
the people of this Island that to enter
confederation would he to give up their
liberty, and he would have the hon.
member to know that the people were
not so ignorant, or easily struck with a
panic; neither would he find them ready
to run from an imaginary foe. They
valued their privileges and were prepared to defend them. The hon. member
for the city (Mr. Brecken) said that the
game of isolation was played out, and
that we could not expect to be allowed
to remain much longer as we were. In
a few minutes afterwards he said the
government ought to make proposals to
the Dominion, and if they were not accepted we could fall back into our former position.
If isolation was played
out, he did not see how it could be
possible that we, after making proposals
to Canada, could fall back into our former position. The hon. member said
also that after the next general election
the members around this board would be
all antis, and that they would be an
inferior class of politicians. This certainly was not very complimentary to
the people of this colony, eight out of
every nine of whom were anti-confederates. Did the hon. member believe that
all the talent and respectability of the
colony was confined to this small minority? The hon. member appeared to
have arrived at such an absurd conclusion. That they were so incapable of
judging for themselves he (Mr. H.) did
not believe. He was aware an impression prevailed, or was attempted to be
created, to the effect that if the $800,000
was received as an equivalent for the loss
of our public lands that they were to be
had by the tenants as a free gift. He
(Mr. H.) endeavored to disabuse some
people of this impression by assuring
them that it would in no way alter the
arrangements now in operation under the
land purchase bill, but that the tenants
would have to pay for their lands by instalments as they now did. He did not
believe we, even if we were to join the
Dominion, would receive that money.
The despatch merely said they would
use their endeavors to obtain it; and he
felt satisfied the Dominion government
would keep the question open for an indefinite period of time. This Island
did not want Canadian money to buy
out the lands of the proprietors; if the
proprietors would sell, there was money
enough in the colony to pay for those
estates.
Mr. BRECKEN said our position was
different from that of Nova Scotia or
New Brunswick. When confederation
took place, they were from the first a
part of the New Dominion, and the exceptions which had since been effected
in favor of Nova Scotia, and which were
complained of in Ontario, could not apply
to this Island, for if we were going to
join the Union, we would be doing so
for the first time. Nova Scotia entered
the union and afterwards complained of
the terms. Her case was therefore like
that of a contractor who, after he completed his engagement, demanded a
larger sum than he was to receive. The
hon. member should recollect that the
powers of parliament were unlimited,
and those power might yet be used to
cripple us. In our present position,
upon what were we dependent but the
good faith and protection of the British
government? With respect to isolation,
his opinion was that it was played out.
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[...]
Mr. MCNEILL understood the hon. member
yesterday to say that annexation would take
place unless we went into confederation.
Now if such a consequence were to result
from our keeping out of the Dominion, he
would not be surprised if the United States
would reduce their tariff in favor of this
Island, for, doubtless, if we had free trade
with the United States, very few persons
would be heard favoring confederation.
Notwithstanding all he (Mr. McNeill) had
heard, he still saw no reason why he should
not remain as we were ; for he thought it
mattered little to Canada whether we united
with her or not, for Canada, he believed,
would eventually amalgamate with the
United States. The hon. member for the
city (Dr. Jenkins) said so, only he would
like to see us unite first with Canada, in
order that it might be the sooner brought
about. It seemed to the opinion of
several distinguished men that annexation
would, in the course of time, take place ;
and if it was true that it could not take place
until we united with Canada, then, if such
was the case, he did not wonder that Great
Britain felt some anxiety on the subject,
especially if she had a wish to retain the
colonies. He thought the offer for union,
if we desired it, should have been made by
us, but as we had declared ourselves opposed
to entering confederation, he thought the
Dominion should not have made proposals
to us at all. An argument had been attempted to be drawn in favor of confederation
from the union effected in Germany;
but he thought it did not apply to our case
at all. If he understood what a panic was,
he thought it was a feeling suddenly
effected—something that took place very
quickly—which he thought would not apply
to the question of confederation, which had,
in one form or other, been for six years
before the people of this Island, who were
as much opposed to it to-day as when the
question was first mooted. Perhaps our
yound men now in college, when they came
to occupy our places, might not see so much
danger in the connection ; and no doubt by
that time it would be better understood.
Public opinion might change, but at present
it was entirely opposed to altering our
position, and he felt convinced it would be
dangerous for any Government to seriously
entertain the question. Probably it was
premature to provide so readily for the
payment of the Lieut. Governor's salary,
but he considered it was the last demand
that could be made upon us, and perhaps
none voted for it with more reluctance than
he did. He thought that demand would
yet appear as a blot upon Great Britain,
whenever the history of the Island was
considered, and the transaction recalled.
Her statesmen might yet regret that they
were parties to a demand which reflected
dishonor upon those who made it. All we
wished was fair play, and to be left alone.
The force of argument which the confedrates might have, and the influence they
could command, we might safely meet with
the unwavering fortress of public opinion.
The people would refuse to accept of confederation upon any terms until the British
Government did justice to this colony ; and
if that were done, our next duty wouldbe
to see if a union was likely to prove a
cordial one ; if not, it would be far better
to keep out of it altogether. As long as he
had a right to raise his voice in the Legislature, he would maintain that this colony
was unjustly treated by Great Britain.
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35
They separated us from Nova Scotia for the
benefit of the proprietors ; had made us pay
our own civil list, and make provision for the
payment of the Lieut. Governor's salary ;
all of which this colony was now doing ; and
it was also fast buying out the estates of the
proprietors. It would, therefore, be exceedingly unjust to force us to unite with
Canada.
Mr. MCCORMACK thought the question had
been pretty well ventilated, and when the
proper time came to discuss the subject,
he would be prepared to give his opinion. He
was opposed to confederation, and represented a district that was also opposed to
enter into a union with Canada, and his
intentions were to oppose entering into
confederation as long as it would be possible
to do so ; not could he understand why
Canada should manifest so much anxiety to
get this Island into the Dominion. He
though it was a matter which concerned the
people of this Island only, and Canada, in
his opinion, should allow us to do our own
work. He was satisfied we could manage
our own little ship much better than they
could do it for us, and thought if we went
into the Canadian cradle and asked them to
take care of us, we should receive a very
severe rocking at their hands.
Mr. G. SINCLAIR said the protection of our
little colony was a matter of grave importance, and caution should be used lest we
hastily or unguardedly disposed of our
rights. His opinions had not undergone
any change from the first. He was opposed to
it still, even in the abstract. The hon
member for the city said isolation was
played out, but he (Mr. S.) saw no occasion
for drawing such a conclusion, or for making
such a statement. Confederation did not
originate with the Imperial Government.
A proposal was made by Nova Scotia for a
legislative union of the Maritime Provinces,
and the hon member for Georgetown (Mr.
Haviland) did not then regard the movement
as emanating from the Home Government,
but as one evincing the desire of some of
the colonial politicians who desired a wider
field and broader basis for the display of
their abilities. To the meeting originating
out of that proposal of Nova Scotia the
Canadian politicians came, and they, by
proposing a wider sphere than the Maritime
Provinces as a political field, aimed through
the movement at settling the dispute between Upper and Lower Canada, and
thereby had succeeded in having the two
Canadas separated, and a stop put to the
continual bickerings which took place be
tween them. He believed all the interests
of the other Provinces would be much better
promoted had they yet retained their former
position, and had full control as formerly in
the management of all their local affairs.
Reference had been made to a panic ; but it
was well known that the people of New
Brunswick were induced by some such means
to vote themselves into confederation, and
he believed all would now allow that Nova
Scotia was not fairly treated ; and, knowing
as we did, that Nova Scotia had made so many
fruitless efforts to free herself, and that
discontent still existed in New Brunswick,
what would likely be our condition in the
future when such was now the case with
those who were geographically united with
Canada ? Our position was such that no
terms could be offered to induce us to unite
with the Dominion, or that it would be our
duty to accept, which would be fair to the
other parts of the Dominion to offer. He
did not think that we should, even if going
into union, accept of a fixed revenue. No
man would accept of a position for a fixed
salary where the expenses and labor would
be constantly increasing ; neither should
this Island, even if it was going into union
with Canada. Our wants would increase, and
with them our expenses also. If we were
in the Dominion we would have to bear the
fortieth part of their expenses for all
general purposes, and if we looked at the
difference between our indebtedness and
that of Canada, we would find that ours was
by £20,000 less than it would have been
had we been, previous to this, a part of the
Dominion ; hence, had we, after the union
of the Provinces, been separated from the
others, like Ontario from Quebec, we would
have been allowed £20,000 less than was now
offered us, and if we went on at the same
rate, our position would be constantly improving. He thought that for several years
to come we would not require a railroad,
and therefore could live under a cheap mode
of taxation. The country was yet in its
infancy, and had but merely commenced the
development of its resources, so that in
twenty years time he believed the commercial and agricultural prosperity of this
Island would be such that we ourselves
would be astonished when we compared it
with the past. We required to improve our
facilities for trade ; to buy in the cheapest
market and sell our products where they
would command the best price. As to the
advantages to be derived from a free trade
with the Dominion, he saw little to encourage us to hope for many benefits from that
source. If the Dominion succeeded, we
could ask to be admitted at any time. With
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36
respect to the $800,000, it had little influence with him. He thought it would be
a long time before we should receive it ; nor
did he see what security or guarantee we
had that we should ever obtain it. He was
included to oppose confederation in toto.
Hon. Mr. HAVILAND said it was difficult,
if not impossible, to ascertain what the
views of hon members were on the government side of the House on this question.
He understood the hon member (Mr.
Callbeck) to say that when he first saw the
proposals of the "better terms" that he
was in favor of them, and the same views
were said to be entertained by Hon. Col.
Secretary.
Hon. Mr. CALLBECK thought the hon
member must have misunderstood him.
What he said was that he took the terms
home and gave them a careful perusal ; and,
after doing so, was convinced they were not
just to Prince Edward Island.
Hon. Mr. HAVILAND still thought the
spirit of the hon member's address was, that
he considered the terms favorable when
he first read them ; at all events he (Mr.
H.) so understood him. He had listened to
the remarks of the hon member for Bedeque,
and admitted that they had more weight
with him (Mr. H.) than those of all the
other hon members who had spoken, for it
was obvious the hon member had studied
the subject ; but still he must confess he
could not tell to which side the hon member
belonged, for, during the delivery of his
able address, he first inclined to one side,
and then to the other. But in his statements he led the committee into a few of
the secrets contained in the correspondence
which took place between the Government
and the Canadian delegates. The hon
member for Princetown stated that had we
been in the Dominion at the time of the
union, it would have made a difference of
£20,000 in the annual amount we would
have received out of the general revenue.
But the hon member should recollect that
the debt of Canada had been caused by the
construction of important public works,
which cost us nothing, but from which we,
in common with them, would receive important advantages. One of the chief
complaints of Upper Canada was, that
Lower Canada received more than her fair
proportion of the revenue for her public
works, and the same objection was now
being made respecting the Maritime Provinces. If, as some hon members concluded,
confederation or annexation was our
destiny, and if the views of hon members
entertaining such sentiments were correct,
they would do well to study the constitution
of the United states ; for if they did, they
would find that each state must defray all
state expenses by a state tax, and that no
state received aid for any purpose out of the
general revenue. Hence, confederation
presented advantages superior to annexation
in this respect.
Adjourned for one hour.
AFTERNOON SESSION.
Hon. Mr. HAVILAND, in reply to the
hon member from St. Peters, Mr. (McCormack) who said he did not understand what Canada
wanted us, stated
that Canada wanted us to assist her in
forming one united nation, extending
from the Atlantic to the Pacific, without
any hostile tariffs to obstruct trade, a
uniform currency, and a connected postal
service. There were reasons laid down
by some of the ablest statesmen in favor
of union, Lard Carnarvon, in a despatch sent to our Lieutenant Governor
in 1867, stated --
"That in time of war and tumult, the armed
forces of British North America should be one
under one supreme command-that in time of
peace, their commerce, their post, their great
lines of communication, and with due regard
to local usuage, their civil and criminal jurisprudence, should be governed by the
same
rules ; that an extended public opinion should
be brought to bear on the settlement of narrow
local controversies, and that the most important affairs of British North America
should be
administered by a combination of the ablest
men whom it can furnish - these benefits appear to me so indisputable, so pervading,
and
so permanent in their character, that I should
be wanting to my duty if I did not express to
you, and through you to the community over
which you preside, my earnest hope that no
trifling obstacle will be allowed to interfere
with their full attainment."
The principles enunciated by Lord
Carnarvon had been endorsed by the
government which now wields the destinies of the British Empire, by its leading men-Mr.
Gladstone and Mr. Bright.
Mr. Bright had been looked upon as a
man who was anxious to get rid of these
colonies, but this was a great mistake.
Despatches had been sent out by the
Colonial Minister, giving reasons for
confederation. The British government
wished us to unite, not that she might
get rid of us, but that we might be no
longer in leading strings, but become a
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER.
37
powerful nation under the meteor flag of
Great Britain. The London Times, the
leading newspaper of England, as had
been quoted by Mr. Brecken last night,
repudiated the idea of Britain giving up
her colonies - Englishmen would shed
the last drop of their blood in defence of
these colonies. We had also the opinion of a statesman, who was even, if
possible, more radical than John Bright,
Mr. Forster, who said --
"I rejoice that the question of the colonies
has been brought forward, inasmuch as it has
made it clear to me that neither in England nor
it the colonies do we intend that the empire
should be broken up."
He (Mr. Haviland) did not wish for
either annexation or independence. but
to retain our connection with Great
Britain. While we were under the aegis
of Great Britain there would be no danger of our being swallowed up by the
United States, but if we retained our
present isolated position, that result
would be almost inevitable. It was not
the glory argument alone that would induce England to retain her hold of these
colonies, there was also the necessity for
having a friendly port for her ship's in
case of war with America. It was not
boasting to say that Britain was mistress
of the seas. The Americans themselves
acknowledged than they had no navy that
could cope with that of England ; and
when the Monarch, that took the remains
of George Peabody to America, dropped
anchor in American waters, she had been
thronged almost day and night with an
admiring crowd. When Mason and
Slidell were taken out of a British ship
by the Americans, England demanded
them back, and sent the flower of her
army across the Atlantic to be prepared
for any contingencies that might arise.
A great deal had been said about the
Munroe doctrine, held by the Americans,
but that did not interfere with us, it was
only to prevent nations of Europe from
establishing new colonies on this continent. The hon. member from Wilmot
Creek (Mr. Laird) had laid down the
principle that the Dominion would never
prosper because they had paid gold for
some of their territory; but the United
States was a prosperous country and a
great part of their territory had been
purchases. In 1808 the United States
purchased the whole of the region west
of the Mississippi, then called Louisiana,
which included not only the present
States of that name, but Arkansas, Missouri, Wisconsin, Iowa and the vast
wild region of the West, for fifteen millions of dollars. In 1818, the disputes
with Spain were settled by a treaty
ceding the whole territory of Florida to
the United States as an indemnity for
the claims of American merchants against
that power. Five millions of dollars
were paid by the American government
to the claimants, which may be considered the purchase money of Florida. New
Mexico and Upper California were purchased from Mexico in 1848 for fifteen
millions of dollars. They had also recently purchased Russian America for a
considerable sum. The States of America would never have become such a great
nation had they remained separate. The
whole revenue that could be raised by
the States before they united was only
three hundred thousand dollars, although
their population was about four millions ;
while the revenue of the Dominion with
about the same population amounted to
fourteen million dollars. If the Dominion was going to come to grief, as
had been stated by some hon. members
why was it that the Americans were
watching the course of events in these
colonies so anxiously. The governors of
some of the States had thought it necessary to warn their legislatures against
'what was now taking place in these
Provinces. They knew that if we had
not a bond of union, we would be like
the bundle of sticks—very weak when
separated, and likely soon to join the
Republic. Governor Chamberlain, of
the State of Maine, had made use of the
following language to his legislature: —
"The effort is now made in the British
Parliament to effect the consolidation of the
Provinces. If it is successful, the result cannot
but be injurious to us. The friends of this
country in the Provinces are earnestly opposing the scheme. It is a matter of more
concern
to us than may appear at first sight, and I cannot fail to press the subject upon
your attention,
not doubting that you will see occasion to make
such remonstrance as you are able, and to secure
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER.
38
the most potent disuasions of the United States
Government."
The speech of Senator Sumner had
ended in a fizzle, but it had put the people of Great Britain on their mettle, and
they had stated that they were prepared
to defend their Government in the position she had taken on the Alabama question.
One of the greatest statesmen of
America, Secretary Seward, gave the
following as his opinion of British
America :—
"Hitherto, he says, "in common with many
of my countrymen, I have thought Canada, or,
to speak more properly British America, a
mere strip lying north of the United States,
easily detachable from the parent state, but incapable of maintaining itself, and,
therefore,
ultimately, nay, right soon to be taken in by the
Federal Union, without materially changing or
affecting its condition. I have dropped this
opinion as a national conceit. I see in B. N.
America, reaching, as it does, across the continent, from the shores of Labrador and
Newfoundland to the Pacific, and occupying a considerable belt of the temperate zone,
traversed
equally with the United States by the Lakes,
and enjoying the magnificent river St. Lawrence, with its thousands of islands in
the river
and gulf, a region grand enough for the seat of
a great empire. In its wheat-fields, its inexhaustible lumber lands, the most extensive
now
remaining on the globe, its invaluable fisheries,
and its yet undisturbed mineral deposits, I see
the elements of wealth. I find its inhabitants
vigorous, hardy, energetic, perfected by the
Protestant religion and British constitutional
liberty. I find them jealous of the United States
and of Great Britain, as they should be, and,
therefore, when I took at their resources, I
know they cannot be conquered by the former,
nor permanently held by the latter.
Those opinions of a great statesman did
not coincide with that of hon. members
who looked upon the Dominion as a
narrow, insignificant strip. The Americans had a great deal to do with respect
to the disturbance in the North-west
territory ; Americans had been settling
there with the expectation that it would
finally become a state of the Union. The
New York Chamber of Commerce had
sent their opinions of this great region to
Congress :—
"The region of Lake Winnipeg, like the
valley of the Mississippi, is distinguished for
the fertility of its soil, and for the extent and
gentle slope of its great plains, watered by rivers
of great length and admirably adapted to steam
navigation. It will, in all respects, compare
favorably with some of the most densely peopled regions of Europe. In other words,
it is
admirably fitted to become the seat of a numerous, hardy and prosperous community.
It
has an area equal to eight or ten first-class
American states. Its great river, the Saskat
chewan, carries a navigable water line to the
base of the Rocky Mountains. It is not at all
improbable that the valley of this river may
offer the best route for a railroad to the Pacific.
Red River, in the north, navigable in connection with Lake Winnipeg for eight hundred
miles, directly north and south, is one of the
best adapted for steam in the world, and waters
one of the finest regions of this continent.
Along the shores of this lake for a distance of
two hundred miles northwards, the mean summer heat is equal to that of Bordeaux in
France,
and at Cumberland, on the Saskatchewan, the
summer temperature is higher than that of
Paris. The soil is for the most part a black
mould of great depth and fertility, producing a
plump and heavy wheat of from twenty to
forty bushels to the acre. Potatoes, barley and
oats can be profitably cultivated between the
forty-ninth and fifty-fourth parallels of latitude,
and Indian corn to the fiftieth. A hundred
miles to the east of the Rocky Mountains commences a great coal-bed, sixty miles in
width,
and extending over sixteen degrees of latitude,
to the Arctic Sea."
Had quotations been taken from the
periodicals of the Dominion, hon. members might say the descriptions had been
too highly colored, but as they had been
taken from those who were almost
enemies of the Dominion, they would
not likely be overdrawn. Since the
Canadians had obtained this vast territory, and the emigration fever was rife
in Great Britain, it was probable the
population of the Dominion would increase very rapidly ; and stalwart energetic men,
when they took up their
abode in a new country, soon earned for
themselves a competency, and added to
the material wealth of the country.
Some hon. members had stated that if
we bought any goods in the Dominion
we would have to pay for them in gold,
but statistics showed that we exported
to the Dominion, in 1868, £107,478 19s
1d. worth of our products, while, during
the same year, we sent to England, not
taking into account new ships, £103,764
13s. 8d worth, and to the Republic only
£48,031 19s. 7d. worth, so that our exports to the Dominion were greater than
to England and nearly three times as
much as to the States. Woollen cloths
could be purchased more cheaply in the
Dominion than in Great Britain, for the
manufacturers of Canada were now exporting to the old country and competing
with British manufacturers, although
obliged to pay a fifteen a per cent. tariff.
Boots and shoes also, and ironmongery
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER.
39
of all descriptions were manufactured in
Canada, and under confederation we
should get all these articles duty free.
A great deal had been said about bribery,
but if the confederates were taunted with
having received Canadian gold, they
could retort by saying that their opponents had received annexation greenbacks, but
he (Mr. Haviland) did not
believe that either party had received
any bribes. Confederation was only a
question of time, but all reforms were
agitated a long time before they were
carried, because there was a certain class
of persons who were always averse to
change. He (Mr. Haviland) was surprised that there were so many members
in the House who had not spoken against
the principle of confederation, but had
only objected to the terms which the
Dominion had offered us. It was a
childish argument to say that Canada
would not pay the $800,000, as it could
be definitely settled how and when the
money should be paid, before we contented to unite. If hon. members were
of opinion that confederation would be
an advantage to the people of this Colony,
and would be the means of extending the
period of British rule on this side of the
Atlantic, it was their duty to let the
Dominion Government know on what
terms they would consent, to go into the
Union, and if Canada refused to comply
with reasonable terms, the fault of not
having these colonies united would lie
with her and not with us.
Mr. REILLY said that when this question of confederation was mooted a few
years ago, he was one of the first to take
up the subject in the press and show the
injustice of the Quebec scheme. He was
gratified at the time to find that the
views of the vast majority of the people
of the country accorded with his own,
and on reviewing the position then taken,
the only mistake he had to acknowledge
as having made at that time was stating
that the scheme had been got up by
ambitions colonial politicians, whereas
it was now known that it was the settled
policy of the Imperial parliament. He
desired to approach the subject with
calmness and not be guilty of using such
unparliamentary language as the hon.
member for Charlottetown (Mr. Brecken) had used towards hon. members on
this side of the House, when he referred
to them as this and that man. Such
language was inexcusable in one who
prided himself on his parliamentary experience. A union of these Colonies
founded on proper principles, might, at
some indefinite period in the future,
prosper ; but the scheme had been too
hurriedly prepared during the progress
of the American civil war, when, as it
appeared to him, the British Government became alarmed at the colossal
military strength, displayed by the Republic, and wished to have a nation
established on this continent that would
be a counterbalance to republicanism.
In this the Imperial Government were
perfectly right, and he regretted that the
treatment of the parent state towards
this Colony had been such as to have its
call upon our loyalty responded to with
coolness and indifference. There was not
the slightest fear but that the British Gov-
ernment would always protect Her Majesty's subjects, for a proof had been given
when they expended such a large sum of
money in rescuing a few captives in
Abyssinia, and also in the case of Mason
and Slidell. A nation that was to last
throughout time should be gradually
formed, and a great mistake had been
made in forcing confederation on these
Colonies in such a hurry ; and to this
cause might be attributed the disturbance
at the Red River and the disaffection in
Nova Scotia. The people of this Island
had opposed the Quebec scheme because
it was unjust, and he (Mr. Reilly) was
prepared to oppose the present terms, for
they were better than those of the Quebec scheme only in a pecuniary point of
view—there was no difference in constitutional points. The people of this
Island had been unjustly dealt with by
Her Majesty's Government, in regard to
the land question, and although they
were still thoroughly loyal, yet if an
attempt were made to force them into
confederation, it would test their loyalty
pretty severely. When the people of
this Island were called upon to surrender
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER.
40
their free government and joins a people
with whom they had hitherto had little
connection, they were justified in acting
very cautiously. The system of representation in the Dominion Senate was
unjust-Canada had an overwhelming
majority. In the republic of America,
the smallest state had the same representation in the senate as the largest. The
Dominion would have many railroads
and other public works, for which, in
the event of union, we would have to
help to pay, while we could make no use
of them for many months in the year.
Instead of receiving the fixed sum of
eighty cents per head, we should receive
a certain amount in proportion to our.
taxation so that as our revenue increased
we would get the benefit of it. These
were some of the reasons which induced
so many persons to avow themselves
anti-confederates, and which he would,
when the propositions came before him,
enter into more fully. The hon. member for Charlottetown had not been very
courteous in designating those who opposed confederation, " powder monkeys,"
" camp followers'," and " smelt fishers "
When the union of Ireland and England
was consummated, Catholic emancipation was guaranteed, but over twenty
years elapsed before it was obtained, and
the land question was still unsettled.
Hon. Mr. HAVILAND said that Catholic.
emancipation had not been mentioned
in the act of union between England and
Ireland, but only promised by some
members of parliament, and they had
failed to carry it.
Mr. REILLY said that we had only the
promise of a government which having so
many difficulties to contend with, could
not reasonably be expected to carry out
their promises, were they ever so desirous of doing so. The people of this Island
had so far worked out their destiny,
and they could get along very well for
the future without uniting with Canada.
He (Mr. Reilly) would never agree to
any action being taken on this question
without the consent of the people.
Mr. BRECKEN - Did the Queen's Printer
allude to him when he said that some
hon. member had called him (Mr. Reilly)
" that man "? If he (Mr. B.) has used
the expression, he had done so uninten
tionally, and would withdraw it. That
hon. member was in error when he
charged him with calling persons in this
House "powder monkies."
Mr. BRECKEN - It was applied to parties
outside of the House. The hon. member
had twitted him (Mr. B.) with using
disrespectful language, but such a charge
came with a very bad grace from one
who, through the
Vindicator, had attacked female virtue, and defames the
teacher of the Normal School.
Mr. REILLY would not allow the hon.
member to misrepresent him, or proceed
without proof for his assertions.
Mr. BRECKEN - The documents were in
the library, and could be obtained if
necessary. The hon. member had denied
that he was in favor of confederation,
but he (Mr. B.) could prove that his
views on that question were the same as
his own. It was amusing to see him
stand up here and claim to be an anti- confederate, when every person knew
that he had been playing fast and loose
on the matter. It would have been
more honorable in him to have given
some credit to another journalist in the
colony, who had been a much more consistent opponent of confederation than
the Queen's Printer. The hon. member
had referred to the Abyssinian war, and
to the Mason and Slidell affair in support of the view that the mother country
would protect her colonies. These cases
were inded evidence that Great Britain
would not allow her subjects to be ill
used by savages, nor her flag to be dishonored on the high seas. The abrogation of
the reciprocity treaty was a charge
which had been brought against the Canadian government, but he (Mr. B.) had
good reason to know it was the Americans themselves who abrogated the treaty.
We had heard that when the hon. member for St. Peters came into this House
a political child, he came in an anti- confederate. True, he did ; and when
we remembered that he had, through the
agitation of this question, been enabled
to defeat an honorable and talented
gentleman, who had long served his party
faithfully and well it did not much redonned to his credit. Yes, that gentleman, after
his faculties had become
impaired, he (Mr. Reilly) had bitterly
attacked, and sought to deprive of his
bread, though trained in this office and
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER.
41
taken into his confidence ; and it was not
until the clods of the valley had closed
over one to whom he owed so much,
and who could no longer meet him in the
political field, that he passed upon him a
feeble eulogy. There was no doubt that
the hon. member for St. Peters had obtained his seat in this House because he
was an anti-confederate, but what were
his opinions now? His paper had been
until lately pretty silent on the question,
but it had hinted that it was this Island's
best policy to get as favorable terms as
she could, and enter the union; and he
had heard a similar expression of opinion from himself.
Mr. BRECKEN - That as Hon. Mr. Howe
had accepted the situation on receiving
better terms for Nova Scotia, our true
interest was to get the best terms we
could and go into the union also.
Mr. BRECKEN - He might deny it as
much as he pleased, but it was nevertheless true. Yet this was the gentleman0
this was the hon. member who stood up
here and told him (Mr. B.) that he ought
to carry out the wishes of his constituents. There was no occasion for such
advice, for, though he (Mr. B.) had the
whole power in his own hands, he would
not vote the Island into confederation
without the consent of the people. He
entirely disapproved of the manner in
which Nova Scotia had been thrust into
confederation by her legislators.
Mr. REILLY said the hon. member had
travelled away from the subject under
consideration to bring up matters connected with a newspaper, of which he
(Mr. B.) had been part proprietor, but
of which he had not been responsible
editor ; but he could say this, that the
statements referred to as having been
libelious in that paper have been proved
by the affidavits of parties some of whom
were now in their graves. With respect
to the Hon. Mr. Whelan, he admitted
that he had been for a short time in
that gentleman's office, but when there
he had always held his own independent
views. He was under no obligation
whatever to Mr. Whelan. We were
both at one time opposed to union, and
it was he that receded from that position.
After the step which Mr. Whelan had
taken, much as he (Mr. R.) admired his
genius and respected him for the valuable
service he had rendered the cause of Liber
alism in this colony, there was no course
open to him (Mr. R.) but to oppose him
on the question of confederation. It was
not true that he had taken bread from
the late Queen's Printer. The office
which he (Mr. R.) now held, he had
never solicited from the party. With
respect to his silence on confederation,
he contended that it was not his place,
while communications were being held
with the government to discuss the
question. But he would ask where the
hon. member for Charlottetown was now
himself, if not on the fence? He had
been a supporter of Mr. J. C. Pope's no- terms resolution, and here he was to-day
speaking in favor of confederation.
Mr. BRECKEN explained that when he
supported the no-terms resolutions,
though he did not then like the wording
of them, it was because he believed that
the Quebec scheme would be adhered
to. It was said at the time that not a
word of it would be altered, to the dotting of an " i " or the crossing of a " t ";
and if that were the case he thought it
would be dangerous to open negotiations.
In voting for these resolutions, he considered it advisable to let his consistency
go, and do the best for the country.
Hon. Mr. LAIRD said the hon. Leader
of the Opposition had this afernoon, in
justification of the purchase of the North
West by Canada, called his attention to
the fact that the United States had frequently purchased territory. But be
(Mr. L.) would. ask whether the Republic
had ever purchased territory where the
people a! the place were opposed to the
transfer? He thought the hon member
could not point out a single instance of
the kind. And more than that, he would
ask when the Thirteen Colonies united
whether any one of them received a sum
of money to induce it to enter the confederacy ? They could not afford such
things ; they had no pampering mother
ready to guarantee them loans to make
purchases or offer inducements ; their
very poverty was a guarantee that the
arrangements between them would be
founded on justice and fair play. The
hon Leader of the Opposition had stated
that the Dominion was the third maritime
power in the world ; this! might be true
of Canada commercially speaking, but
where was her navy, or the funds to
build it? One of the causes of the Red
River rebellion he said, was the influx
from the United States of immigrants who
had gone there to stir up opposition to the
transfer of the territory to the Dominion.
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER.
42
He (Mr. L.) would pit against this statement that of a greater statesman than
even the Leader of the Opposition,
namely, the Hon. Joseph Howe, who
said that the North West troubles chiefly
arose from the disaffection of the employees of the Hudson Bay Company,
who thought they would get nothing by
the sale of the territory- that all the
money would go to the shareholders of
the Company, and their claims would
probably be entirely overlooked. The
inhabitants of Red River were not
all half breeds and indians, but many of
them were Scotchmen, who would not
like to see their liberties trampled upon;
however, though, they were all half
breeds that was no reason why their
rights should not be respected. If any
government was to propose purchasing
this Island irrespective of the wishes of
the people, he (Mr. L.) could fancy how
the [illegible] tones of the hon Leader of the
Opposition's voice would be raised in
indignantly denouncing the proceedings.
The hon member had also referred to the
importance of having a railway running
through British territory to the Pacific.
Hundreds of miles of country through
which such a railway would have to
pass were barren, and the whole of it
covered with snow nearly six months in
the year, consequently, the expense of
keeping the line clear, together with the
limited traffic it wold draw for some
time, would make it no very desirable
undertaking. He (Mr. L.) thought it
necessary to allude to remarks several
times made by hon members of the
Opposition respecting the course pursued
by parties outside this House, He maintained that if any hon member wished to
reply to statements outside, he should go
outside to meet his opponent, and not
come in here to make accusations under
the protection of the sergeant-at-arms.
Some gentlemen appeared to be horrified
because one portion of the press had
charged the other with "birbery and
corruption."
Hon. Mr. HAVILAND said his remarks
on this subject were in reply to the hon
member, Mr. McNeill.
Hon. Mr. LAIRD.- Forty eight hours
ago, before Mr. McNeill had spoken in
this debate, the hon Leader of the Opposition had referred to the charges of
bribery and corruption made outside the
House, and he (Mr. L.) would ask what
right had the squabbles of the press to be
dragged in here?
Hon. Mr. HAVILAND said he had the
right to speak in this House on any outside question he pleased.
Hon. Mr. LAIRD.- Let the press outside
answer the press outside; but since the
matter had been brought up here, he would
venture to say, judging from documents
which had been published, that a portion of
the press of the Colony had been tampered
with, he would not say through the agency
of Canadian, but of confederate gold.
When he used the expression confederate
gold, he meant some inducement that caused
a reversion of policy. Now, this was rather
a serious matter, for if the press which was
the fourth estate, could be tampered with,
might not hon members of this House be
dealt with in the same way, and then what
would become of the rights of the colony?
Hon. members need not be so very indignant
about the alarm sounded by the press;
bribery had been brought to bear in the
case of larger unions than ours. Look at
the conduct of certain members of the Irish
parliament at the time that country became
united with England. [illegible] had been
the results of that union, and he (Mr. L.)
contended that where money was held out
as an inducement to any country to unite
with another no union on such a basis
could be expected to succeed.
Mr. BRECKEN would call it bribery when
any inducement was held out to a public
man to make him swerve from his own
opinions. But he did not think that if a
person shose to invest some hundreds of
pounds in a printing establishment, it could
be called bribery. It was easy to understand the difficulties with which the press
had to contend in this country. They took
up a certain course and pursued it, and if
the cause they advocated should break
down, they had then to turn right round.
The hon member for Bedeque no doubt
referred to a certain case which had lately
occurred in this city, where a bill of sale had
been given. If [illegible] talents and acquirements had been bought over to advocate
a question, then it would be bribery;
but, on the other hand, if it were only presses
and type that had been bought, it would be
simply a mercantile transaction. He (Mr.
B.) had great respect for a portion of the
anti-confederate press; it had hitherto accorded him justice, and sometimes perhaps
more than justice, but if he should now
happen to differ from it, he felt assured that
such divergence would only be for a short
time. He (Mr. B.) could not agree with
the hon member for Bedeque when he
argued that the government had only met
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER.
43
the delegates from Ottawa informally, or
simply as private gentlemen. If this was
the case, why, he would ask, was their visit
referred to in the opening speech? The
delegates were authorized to come here by
a resolution of the Dominion parliament,
and it was not very probable that they
would consider their mission fulfilled by
merely holding a conference with the members of the government as private gentlemen.
No, no; Sir George Cartier, the
Hon. Mr. Pilley, and the Hon. Mr. Kenny
were too shrewd and experienced politicians
to lay themselves open to the taunt of Mr.
Galt and others in the Canadian parliament
that they had offered terms to the Island
government which the latter would not
accept. He (Mr. B.) presumed that the
proposals from Ottawa were something like
the terms which the delegates had been
given to understand, by the government,
would be acceptable. If not, it was strange
that the Dominion government should waste
paper in sending down these proposals here.
If the hon Colonial Secretary had used the
strong language in presence of the Canadian
delegates which he had in this House, and
the hon member, Mr. Callbeck, had told
them it was better for this colony to wait
until we saw how the Dominion succeeded,
he (Mr. B.) felt certain we would not have
had such proposals brought to our notice.
Whether it was before or after the visit of
the delegates that the hon member for
West River took the terms home with him,
lighted a candle, and in the silence of night
studied over them until he arrived at the
conclusion that they were neither just nor
liberal to this colony, he (Mr. B.) was
unable to say, but he hoped that [illegible] this
time the Canadian gentlemen had received
the benefit of his cogitations (Laughter.)
Hon. COLONIAL SECRETARY said that the
hon member for Charlottetown had referred
last night to the blind king of Hanover
being driven from his throne, and instanced
Britain's non-intervention in the matter as
an evidence that she was in favor of Prussian
confederation. The conduct of the British
government with regard to that king, and
the German question generally, was more
influenced by the opinions of the Manchester
school of politicians, than by any desire to
see the consolidation of the Prussian empire.
With respect to the taunts of the Opposition about the government, not h aving power
to settle the land question, he (Col. Sec.)
believed they were just as able to settle
the land question here as Mr. Gladstone
was to settle the same question in Ireland.
Probably most hon members had seen that
the Canadian government had advertised
for six schooners to protect the fisheries.
He contended they would do no good as
regarded the fisheries, and would be very
apt to create a disturbance with the
American government, and bring on a war,
which might involve this colony in trouble
and expense.
Adjourned till to-morrow.
This individual participated in:
