104 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 1873
WEDNESDAY, April 30.
MR. McNEILL.- Mr. Speaker, the hon. member, the Leader of the Government said the Terms offered
for our acceptance now, are not as good as we are entitled to. This may be so. For
my part I was alwaays one of those who thought Prince Edward Island, under proper
management, could raise means sufficient to supply all her wants. But now I am sorry
to observe that both sides of this House seem to be of the opinion that Confederation
is inevitable, either on the Terms now offered or better if they can be obtained.
But let us see what has brought about this state of affairs. In answering this question
I feel bound to say that the Government which introduced and carried the Railway Bill
through the Legislature, was the part at whose door the cause producing that which
we now deplore, must be laid. If the Railway and Confederation are to benefit this
Island, then no man will deserve more credit for the measure than the hon. member
the Leader of the Government. Ever since the time of the Quebec Conference the people
have closely watched their public men, and any of them who expressed a desire in favor
of the Confederation, had no chance of being returned. At all their public meetings
the question had been
discussed, and their representatives understood very well what the feeling of their
constituents was on the question. In a word, the people were prepared for everything
but that which happened. The people of this Island never supposed any body of men
would come into power who would pass a measure of such magnitude without their consent.
But such a party did arise. Well do I recollect how at that time the prosperity of
the country was set forth. Not only when the road would be building, but ever afterwards,
was this Colony to be in a flourishing condition. How different the experience of
the reality, with what was then so glowingly pictured in the speeches of hon. members.
It was not the paltry outlay upon bridges which produced the pressure now felt upon
the public funds of the Colony. I am surprised that the hon. member should refer to
such matters in the manner he did. After listening to his speech on Nomination day,
I did expect to see him coming down with better arguments than those which he has
used in this discussion. On Nomination day the hon. member thought a branch line of
the Railroad was required for Rustico, and I did expect to hear that he was going
to ask this of the Dominion Government, instead of the small and trifling matters
to which he referred; such as our Drill Sheds, &c. I am inclined to believe now, that
the speech of the hon member on that occasion was delivered more for the purpose of
defeating my election, than anything he intended to do for Rustico. Matters, however,
have come to such a pass that the people saw no alternative but to enter into a union
with the Dominion. If better Terms can be had, so much the better. But this I do not
expect. I told my constituents that I would not consent to lay one dollar more of
taxation upon them unless the Terms brought down were accepted. There are many lease
holders in my district, and they find
1873 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 105
the rent tax enough. One great error on the part of the former Government was the
haste with which the Railway Bill was pushed through the Legislature. And if there
is any value at all in the Engineer's Report, it is in the information it contains
on this point. With respect to the rest of their Report it is not worth the paper
it is written on. There was no person in the Legislature, when the Bill was passed,
who knew anything about Railroads, therefore, the time allowed for its consideration
was too short. With respect to the branch lines, it was well understood by my constituents
that the main Trunk was undertaken without the consent of the most of the people,
and they knew also when the main line was undertaken, the branches were to follow.
It may be asked how I know this? I answer by saying that when the Railway Bill was
before the House, petitions, numerously signed, came in against the measure. But when
the branch line Bill was before us, no petition came in against it. This shows that
the people knew and understood we would have to build the branch lines. It was neither
the building of the branches, nor the effect produced by the Engineer's Report, which
led to the unpopularity of the late Government. In my district these considerations
did not influence half a dozen of votes. It was the School Question which caused my
majority to be but fifty at the last election. I am not going to say whether the late
Government did right or wrong, but this I will say: They appealed to the people, and
in so far as their policy on Confederation went, have carried the country with them.
Nor do I doubt but that if the hon. member had appealed to the country in the same
waay with his Railwaay measure, though he would not have been sustained, at all events
he would have incurred less blame. Considering the smallness of the Island, and the
limited revenue of
the Colony, the measure, to say the least of it, amounted to a reckless piece of legislation.
If we have to give up our Statute as a separate Colony, and go into Confederation,
we will require the ability of all our ablest men to secure the best Terms we can
obtain, (hear.) But in attempting to re-open negotiations with the Dominion Government
on this question, we had better take care we do not lose more thant we will gain.
The Dominion Government have to contend with an able and vigilant opposition, and
unless the Government are certain that better Terms are to be had, this House should
not consent to open up negotiations again. Under the Terms brought down we can get
along much better in Confederation than out of it. But under and circumstances we
will have to resort to local taxation to meet the internal requirements of the country.
You cannot show me any country which can get along without taxation. We see at this
moment that the United States Government have now to incur expense in putting down
a war with the Indians; nor do we know but the same may occur in Canaada. They are
encroaching upon the lands long held by the original owners of the soil, and when
they come to be driven out of their possessions and hunting grounds, it is hard to
say what may not take place. I have no special benefit to receive or expect from any
Government, but hope every hon. member will use his best efforts to see that justice
is done to the country at large. While I hope and trust there will be no ill feeling
manifested on either side in dealing with this very important question, (hear.)
MR. ARSENAULT.- Mr. Speaker, in rising to offer a few remarks upon this question, I do not know
that I can throw any new light upon the subject. In listening to the speeches of hon.
members on both sides, it was noticeable that each party threw blame upon the other,
for the state of affairs exist
106
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 1873
ing in this Colony at present. Perhaps the sins are as heavy on the one side as the
other. For my part, ever since Confederation was first mentioned, I thought sooner
or later we would have to unite our destinies with those of the Dominion. When the
Railway Bill was passed, it was said that it was with a view of forcing this Island
into Confederation. I never heard such a matter mooted, nor for one did I for a moment
believe anything of the kind. And moreover, I believe if the men, who introduced and
carried the measure, had been allowed to complete what they began, it would have been
better for the country. When the late Government was formed, it is well known the
country at large did not force the building of the extension lines upon them. It is
well known that the men who wished to build these, left the Government of Mr. Pope,
and for that support, the Government met the views of the Eastern members on that
question. But little did I suppose that the Opposition would adopt a principle they
found so much fault with. Certainly their act in that matter was much more inconsistent
than anything which can be alleged against Mr. Pope's Government for consenting to
go into Confederation. The late Government have been in the habit of arguing that
four- fifths of the people were opposed to building the Railway. This I deny. Eighteen
members voted for the Bill, and of these the members of the first third, and fifth
Districts of Prince County, had the instructions of their constituents to do so. So
had the representatives of Charlottetown and Georgetown, and the other eight had,
I suppose, partly the consent of their supporters for what they did, so that I contend
a majority of the people were in favor of the measure. But if, as they say, four-fifths
of the people were opposed to building the Railroad, how was it that the late party
went in for the immediate construction of fifty
miles more without the consent of their
constituents ? It was said the allowance for land damages was too high, and that such
is the case I know myself. I believe in some instances the allowance has been five
hundred per cent too high. In one place $500 has been paid for the right of way for
a distance of five chains through a mud hole, when the whole piece through which the
road passes is not worth $100. $40,000 was paid to the contractors for consenting
to allow the station to be altered at Summerside. I mention these as a few out of
many instances of extravagance which I might name, to show how uselessly they have
been spending the public money. I am not pledged on Confederation or any other question.
My constituents have left me free to vote as I may consider best for the interests
of the country. The hon. member for Belfast came down upon this side of the House
for the extra allowance last year to hon. members. I see no reason why he should do
so. The late Government were in the majority, and might have prevented it. Each of
them took the money, and having done so, I do not see why they should make a hobby
horse of it to ride themselves into an argument. I will support the motion for going
into committee, and shall vote in favor of a delegation being sent to Ottawa, to arrange
for better Terms. Each hon. member should do his best to further the interests of
the Colony, and when that is done, no blame can attach to any one.
MR. ROWE.—Sir, in rising to offer a few remarks upon the question before us—a question which
involves giving up our constitution—I will be as brief as possible ; and in the offset
may say, that I was elected to a seat in this House by the constituencey of Murray
Harbor, to go for accepting the present Terms. This is the engagement entered into
between them
1873 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 107
and myself, and from which I will neither release them nor myself, unless very good
reasons are shown why I should do so. Certainly if better Terms can be had I shall
offer no objections to them. But that they will be obtained appears to be very doubtful.
I have been one of the most determined of the anti-Confederate, anti-Railway, and
anti-Grant men in the country. These are my principles, and to them I will hold. They
are also the principles of my constituents. But they, like reasonable men, seeing
the position in which the country has been placed, believe it is better to receive
the present offer, and go into Confederation. Were it not for the villainous and vicious
policy of a former Government, we would not now be in a position which called for
surrendering our position as a separate and independent Colony. I was last autumn
elected as an anti- Confederate. When the House was dissolved this spring I did not
go to the people to get their support for reelection. A number of gentlemen waited
on me to know what my opinion was upon the situation of the country. I told them I
had not thought over the matter sufficiently to say what my opinion was. They said
they had changed their mind one one question, and believed that under existing circumstances
we would have to accept of Confederation, and asked me if I would consent to become
their representative. In reply I said, if you, knowing my principles, have confidence
enough in me to send me there, and will allow me to keep my opinions in abeyance,
and take my own way when there, I will. Well, after the Terms came down I went among
the people and laid them before them, telling them they would have to choose these,
or increased taxation. I did not try to persuade them as to what they should do, but
placed Confederation or taxation before them, asking them to
say which they would choose. They choose the former. And now Sir, it becomes us to
see what the basis of the union of the different Provinces is. The basis seems to
have been laid down at the Quebec Conference, and was the indebtedness of each Province.
Now is this, or is it not a proper basis ? If so, then in so far as I can see, the
delegates have made an arrangement for the admission of this Island into a union with
the Dominion, in consistency therewith. If, on the other hand, they are going to send
another delegation to Ottawa, it becomes them to shew that this basis is an improper
one. It appears that the present and prospective debt of the Dominion, for fifteen
years to come, were made up, which brought up their indebtedness to $45 a head, and
starting with that as basis agreed to, the Terms have been brought down in accordance
therewith. This was, I think a wise arrangement on the part of our delegates. They
looked forward to the probable increased indebtedness of the Dominion for ten or fifteen
years, and thereby secured a large margin in our favor. This shows the Dominion Government
are willing to deal fairly with us. It shows too, that if our resources had not been
wasted on the Railroad, what an excellent position we would be in to-day, and how
much more we would receive from the Dominion for local purposes. If the Government,
or the majority of this House are going to send up another delegation, they should
show, before asking for a vote in support of such a motion, that there was some omission
on the part of the late delegates. On submitting their resolution there should be
no concealment as to what they intend to ask for. If the late delegates failed to
ascertain the full amount of the indebtedness of the Dominion, or omitted any important
point which should have been taken into account ; then the hon. member,
108
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER 1873.
the Leader of the Government, is perfectly justified in asking for a delegation to
go to seek for better Terms than those they brought down. But as they have not shown
that such is the case, and as I fail to see that they have any just reason for the
course they are pursuing, I do not feel that it is my duty to support the motion.
Had we not entered into the wild speculation of building the Railroad, our public
debt would be $4,000.000 less than it is, which at 5 per cent would yield an annual
revenue of $200,000. Who, therefore, having the good of the country at heart, is
there but what must regret that that road was ever built. Had it not been for that
costly undertaking, we would have had that amount of money placed to our credit, the
interest of which might have been drawn for the internal improvements of the country.
Why it would have made our little Island almost a paradise. The road, I am confident,
will never pay its working expenses. The financial affairs of the Colony have been
gone into so fully by the hon. member, the Leader of the Oppposition, the hon. member
for New London. and my learned and hon. colleague, that I deem it unnecessary to go
into that matter. Indeed, they have so lucidly set that matter before this hon. House,
that the Government have entirely
failed to show that they are justified
in going to Beck for better Terms, or
able to disprove the statements set
forth by my hon. friends on this side
of the House.
MR. ARCH. J. MCDONALD.—I
must say, Mr. Speaker, that I am not.
like a great many—or like the hon.
member who spoke last—a Confederate
from necessity On the contrary, I have always been in favor of a union of the Colonies,
but not having been in public life my opinions were not known. I believed all along
that Confederation would materially ad
vance the general interests of this Island. The public mind, for a number of years
has heen so excited by the
agitation kept up on this question, that
it was very difficult to get the people
to give this subject a calm and impartial consideration. I can distinctly
refer back to a public meeting, where
the suhject was discussed, which I
atttended shortly after the first delegation was sent to Canada. On that
occasion the junior member for Belfast was present, enlightening the
people with his advice and eloquence.
And to this day I have not forgotten
the manner in which he pictured the
evils which would fall upon.us should
we join the Dominion of Canada. He
pictured Canada as a poor, barren,
narrow strip of country. I do not
remember whether the hon. member
had a map or not, (laughter). but if
so, it was something of the kind by
means of which he or his party went
through the country with; showing the
curves of the Railroad, by the use of
which I suppose he undertook to convince the people how foolish they
would be to unite with such a miserable country. Most heartily do I
congratulate the hon. member on his
change of views. But change they
yet will, I have no doubt, on another
question too.
MR. LAIRD.—I suppose the hon
member thinks so.
MR. ARCH. J. MCDONALD—The
Terms brought down, are, I consider,
very fair indeed. I have not the
slightest doubt but if the people had
been in earnest in the matter, that as
good, if not better Terms, could have
been obtained before. But the hostility of the country to a movement in
that direction, kept alive and fostered by political agitators, was such, that those
of our public men who were Confederate dared not approach the question at all. Well,
the late Government went to the country with these
1873 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 109
Terms, and I contend that the people voted against them. But while doing so they
also voted in favor of the
principle of Confederation; a majority declaring that we were justly entitled
to better Terms still. Such being the case I contend that it is the duty of this
side of the House to see what
better Terms can yet be obtained, and I am sanguine we will soon form a
part of the Dominion of Canada on Terms which will be just and liberal, and which
will be much better than
those recently brought down. Those already offered may satisfy me, the
hon. member for Belfast and others, but we have to recollect that there are
many men in the Colony who are not
satisfied with them. In entering into union with the Dominion, it is a matter of
great importance to have as
many of the people of this Colony as possible satisfied with the conditions upon
which we enter. Under such circumstances the advantages of Confederation would sooner
become apparent. It would be very wrong to force a large proportion of the people
into union against their will, and I think when the Dominion Government will see that
we are in earnest, as an arrangement can be made that will satisfy the great body
of the people. The figures have been gone over pretty fully. I would, perhaps, differ
with hon. members on both sides in some of their calculations, but the difference
is not very material. I think it is much more desirable that the question should
be fairly laid before the people, and to guard against their being mislead by statements
not strictly correct. One hon. member said 9 1/2 per cent is the average duty paid
on articles in the Dominion. I do not think the hon. member is quite correct. It
may be the average on most of the articles, but there may be an excess on others..
which will make a very material difference. These are matters we cannot look too
carefully into, nor can we
speak very positively regarding the future on such questions. Changes will take place,and
the probability is, that in, or out of the Dominion, our duty in ten years will be
higher, than it is now. The Opposition have endeavoured to make a point about the
building of the Railroad, and to talk loudly about the burden it has imposed upon
the country. Unless they show more skill in debating that subject than they have
yet used, they might as well give that argument up. They take credit to themselves
for getting the people to consent to Confederation, and for the ability they displayed
in securing the Terms . brought down. Yet according to their own showing and admission,
they could not have done so but for the Railroad. I contend Sir, that the building
of the Railway will be of permanent advantage to the Colony. The advance in the
price of labor must amount to more than the interest of the cost of its construction.
Four cents a day for the male working population gives about $216,000 per year, and
sixteen cents makes $900,000 a year of an increase in favor of the labor populaion
of the Colony. Then again, equally puerile are their arguments when they assert that
the exchange required to pay the interest of the Railway debt, will embarrass the
trade of the Colony. They might as well say that the building of the Prince Edward
Steam Boat ship, which cost £30,000 sterling, had injured the trade of the city, because
paying for the vessel drew that amount of exchange from the country. They may make
people who do not understand business believe it, but it is unworthy the position
of any hon. member to use such arguments on the floor of this hon. House, (hear.)
Had the present Government been in power last year, the difficulties, of which
so much is now said, would not have been heard of. I think, Mr. Speaker, that the
110
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 1873
present and prospective standing of
the Dominion of Canada, is such as is in every way encouraging. I believe it is our
duty and interest to try and get in under the best Terms we can, and make their interests
ours, and ours to be theirs also, as we shall march onward to participate in the bright
future before the Dominion of Canada. (Applause.)
Hon. Mr. McEACHEN.— Mr. Speaker, I do not understand why the hon members on the opposite side of this
hon. House should deem it their duty to be so frequently taunting the Catholic members
on the School question. I am a grant man, nor am I ashamed of my views ; on the contrary,
I hope the time will come when justice will be done to them. If Catholics are opposed
to having their children instructed in the mysteries of heathen mythology, in the
public schools, and choose to educate them at their own expense, they have no right
to be taunted because they use their own money in doing this. Although the supreme
head of our church is now a prisoner, yet nevertheless, I wish hon. members opposite
to know, that we do not intend to let our claims drop. We shall press them when we
shall be in a position honorably to do so. With respect to Confederation, I am forced
to consent to it on the principle of expediency, but not of choice. For this I blame
the late Government. By assertions the most reckless, and slanders as vile as could
be conceived and uttered, they succeeded in defeating a popular Government. Thet led
the people to believe that wrong to an alarming extent was going on ; that the Engineers,
including Mr. Boys, were aiding the Government in defrauding the people. Few men were
more abused than Mr. Boyd, simply because he was on our side. The love they had for
the loaves and fishes was so strong, that when
they
attained to power they eat their promises, and greedily swallowed their convictions.
They had to do so, or yield up the reins of power. I laid a trap for them and into
it they all fell. (Laughter). Yes, after all these slanders, and strong assertions
for the contrary, they went in for constructing the branch lines. For any of those
abominable lines and slanders I do not blame the hon. member for New London, but this
I do say, he took advantage of them and used them to aid him in carrying out his "Dashaway
Policy," The hon. member charged the PopeHowlan Government with making the road longer
than it was expected it would be. Well, on that question at least, they have the answer
of the inspecting Engineers. They brought the New York Engineers here and sent them
on the road to curse both it and the men who undertook its construction. Respecting
the length the Engineers say : "The tables above presented, in our opinions, shew
that while it was possible to have so run the Railway, that its total length between
the termini would have been, say in the neighborhood of five miles less than it is,
yet that this could not have been done without increasing the cost per mile to a sum
greater than the limit fixed by the Railway Act" Further on in the Report they add
: "Our attention has been called to the fact that in the debates on the Railway Act,
and also in the contract,- which was drawn up we believe before any surveys had been
made,- the total length of the road between the termini Alberton and Georgetown, is
spoken of as 'about 120 miles.' We do not know upon what data this distance was estimated
; it seems clear however, on the inspection of the map, that a line but 120 miles
in length cannot be run between these places, intersecting the points the Government
directed it should intersect, even if it were quite straight, without a curve, other
than such as would be
1873 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 111
needed for changes of direction. An
estimate of the cost of road is appended. This estimate should be kept in
view in connection with what has been
said on the subject of location." Yet,
notwithstanding this clear and reasonable answer to their pointed enquiries,
the Government of which the Hon.
Mr. Haythorne was President, and his
friend, Hon. Mr. Sinclair, the Leader
in this House, wrote for further explanations on a question answered so
plainly. Do curse the road they
seemed to say. (Laughter.) Well,
here is the answer to their next enquiry: "Now the question is asked
why is the total length of the Railway
more than 'about 120 miles?' To this
interrogatory we beg leave toanswer
that it is because it cannot be materially
less, and intersect the points named in
the orders of the Government of
Prince Edward Island to the Government Engineer, who had charge of
locating the line; neither do our observations point out to us that the
main line could, under any circumstances, be mnch less in length than it
is; certainly not, unless at a greater
expenditure than that fixed by the
Railway Act." After having received
this answer, I wonder they are not
ashamed to rise up on the floor of this
hon. House, and say that the Government of hon. Mr. Pope made the main
line longer than it should have been.
But Sir, they are as destitute of shame
as their party is of consistency. What
have they done? They have allowed
a higher grade on the branches than
was permitted on the main line, while
they have given nigh $1,000 a mile
more for its construction. With respect to curves, from a point within
three miles of Souris they have five
miles of road. I do not blame them
for this. But why had they not the
manliness to extend the same justice
to others? My constituents are
strongly opposed to Confederation,
but knowing they do that the reck
less extravagance and gross mismanagement of the late Government
have brought about the present state
of affairs, they allow me to exercise
my unbiassed judgment in dealing
with Confederation. I am free, there
fore, to give to the Resolution my cordial support.
Debate adjourned for one hour.
MR. CALLBECK — Mr. Speaker,
while it is expected that each member
will express his views on this question,
it is noticeable that a good deal of
repetition has been uttered in what
has already been said. Some hon.
members say they have, against their
will, been convinced that Confederation is inevitable. I question if in
this respect it is as much against their
will as they would wish many to
suppose. Hitherto I have been opposed to Confederation, but am now
fully convinced that our duty is to
Unite with the Dominion of Canada.
If we do not, then we will have to
resort to increased taxation immediately ; and to this I believe the country at large
is opposed. The hon.
member from Egmout Bay gave utterance to what was no doubt the candid
truth, when he said both sides were
chargeable with the causes which produced this state of affairs ; although
other hon. members seem to think it
is wholly due to the action of the late
Government in building the branch
lines and other matters in which they
took a part during their administration.
The hon. member for Souris, with
respect to building the branch lines,
said he laid a trap for the Government.
How this was done is best known to
the hon. member himself. I do know,
however, that the branch lines formed
a part of the Railway Act, and by it
they had to be carried into effect, as
much as the building of the main line,
the only difference being as to time.
112PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER.1873
MR. CALLBECK.—I understood the
hon. member to say, when he was
speaking on this question, that the
immediate construction of the branch
lines had been forced upon the late
Government by a trap which the hon.
member laid for them.
MR. CALLBECK.—I take it then
that the Coalition Government was
pledged to the immediate construction
of the branch lines, moreover I have
it on good authority that his honor,
the leader of the present Government promised, before the dissolution
last year, to go for their immediate
construction, and that this arrangement was agreed to and signed on
behalf of Mr. Pope's Government, by
him as President of the Executive
Council. Such being the case, the
late Government was, according
to constitutional usage, morally bound
to accept and carry out the conditions
thus bequeathed to them by their
predecessors. In carrying out that
stipulation, however, the lines were
ran, and surveys made, before the contract was let, and every precaution
taken to guard against injustice being
done to the country. The Leader of
the Government said the 21/2 per cent
imposed would raise sufficient of
revenue to meet the necessary expenture. Besides, it was well known,
that no further outlay would be required until the present session. I
contend, therefore, that in building the
branches the late Government did not
| $45 per head amounts to |
$4,230,945 |
|
| Interest on the above at 5 per cent, gives |
$211,547 |
|
| Amount brought forward, |
|
$211,547 |
| Ditto on $900,000 |
|
45,000 |
| Ditto on $69,000 for our Law Courts, |
|
3,450 |
| Legislative Grant, |
|
30,000 |
| Head Money, |
|
75,000 |
| One per cent on Railway debt being |
|
|
act inconsistently. With respect to
the financial question, I would simply
remark, that if an individual was doing a legitimate business and that all
of a sudden he rushed into a speculation which increased his indebtedness
eighteen fold, would it be any wonder
if he found his credit injured in consequence ? It is precisely so with a
Government. In 1869, our public
indebtedness amounted to but $5 a
head, while that of the Dominion was
$25 a head. Ours is now up to $40,
while by the Terms the delegates have
brought down, the Dominion debt, has
—or soon will be—up to $45. Now
when the short space of four years
our debt per head of the population
has increased from $5 to$40 a head,
is it any wonder that the public debt
of the Colony has suffered in consequence? Unquestionably it is the
duty of every public man to use his
best efforts to maintain the credit of
the Colony. But I have not met with
one man who can point out how our
public credit can be restored outside
of Confederation. I am not opposed to
seeking better Terms providing it can
be shown that these now offered are
unjust or unfair towards this Colony.
I have carefully looked into the matter, and believe that the Dominion
Government, in the Terms agreed to
with the delegates, have allowed us as
much as they could ; and that they
could not have consented to more
favorable Terms, without doing injustice to the other Provinces. Our
cash receipts from the Dominion, under the Terms brought down, would
be as follows:— '
1873 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER 113
| the interest we pay, |
|
32,500 |
| Interest on $22,000 for Steam Dredge, |
|
1,100 |
| Thus our annual cash receipts from the
Dominion would be |
|
$398,597 |
I will now invite your attention Mr. Speaker, and that of this hon House, to
what our receipts would be under the Dominion Tariff ; supposing we were to
adopt it and remain as we are.
| Customs and Excise, |
$308,850 |
|
| Stamp Tax, |
5,000 |
|
| Bank Impost, |
250 |
|
| Distilling Licenses, |
600 |
|
| Light and Anchorage Duties, |
2,000 |
|
| Post Office Revenue, |
10,000 |
|
| Savings Bank, |
3,700 |
|
| Malt and Tobacco Taxes, |
10,000 |
|
| Fees from Customs, |
1,000 |
$341,400 |
| Thus leaving in our favor a balance of
by the terms of Messrs. Laird and
Haythorne. |
|
$57,197 |
| To which we may add for salaries and
other expenses borne by the Dominion, the further sum of |
|
94,000 |
| Thus showing a total of |
|
$151,197 |
Which shows clearly that we have in
the arrangements entered into the best
of the bargain. In dealing with this
question of union, the Dominion Government have laid down a principle
based upon the indebtedness of each
Colony, and it is unreasonable to suppose that Canada will now step aside
from it. To do so would virtually
alter the foundation upon which the
whole superstructure of the Dominion
is built. We have no right to ask for
more than what is right and reasonable. And even were we to obtain
more, we would find in the end that it
would only open the door for similar
demands from the other Provinces.
When the Terms came down, I examined them carefully, and the more
closely I look into them, the more
reasonable they appear to me to be. I have also heard several say it would be a risk
to trifle with them. Because it the Dominion have offered and
agreed to Terms that are just to us,
it we open up negotiations again, we
will leave it in their power to withdraw them. And this the Government of Canada might
be induced to
do if they apprehended an opposition
in Parliament to them, which they
might not be able to overcome, therefore, I think it is far better to hold on to what
we have. Were it not for our isolated position I believe they would not have dealt
so liberally with us. Of all the public works likely in the future to be undertaken
in the Dominion, there will be none from which this Island will receive more direct
and immediate benefits, that the Bay de Verte Canal. By it a short route will be opened
up to St. John and the seaport cities of the neighboring Republic. Indeed, I question
if it will be of any more advantage to those on the main land than it will be to ourselves.
So great will the advantage be, which will accrue to us
114
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 1873
from that work, that I think the one- fortieth part of the estimated cost ought not
to be deducted from the amount charged against us. Then, with respect to what Mr.
Tilley has said, if
his statementsn are not correct, he will be corrected. But I take it that his statements
are correct. The Leader
of the Government in his calculations .
has not, I think, shown any more ability in dealing with the financial
aspects of the question, than the Leader of the Opposition. For my part I
question if he has shown as much. I
cannot for one agree with him that one third should be struck off from what the sale
of public lands is set
down for. I admit, if it were to fall off
as Lot 19 did, there might be some
reason for making such a calculation,
but this is not what we may expect.
Our delegates have done well for the
Colony in securing $800,000 for the
purchase of our public lands. When
land can be bought, and the proprie- .
tors disposed to sell, the money can be
drawn for, as may be required. So
that I think we have in this arrange-
ment the prospect of being able to
buy out the last of the proprietors.
No doubt to effect this we shall have
the assistance of the Dominion Gov-
ernment. The home Government
never could understand why a farm
of 100 acres, though wholly covered
with wood, was not cheap to a poor man at the rate of £5 a year But
the Dominion Cabinet is composed of men who fully understand the ques-
tion. Under all the circumstances, I
think we can get along for a consider-
able time under the Terms proposed,
without having to resort to an increase
of local taxation. The remarks of the
hon. member for Georgetown, respecting the increased value of labor. might have some
weight if we had a surplus of laborers, but as we have not, I cannot see any force
in the
argument. It has also been said that the country as a whole oppose the present Terms.
But in this hon.
House there are but two members who
are really anti-Confederate, and I respect them for their consistency, while I cannot
but admire the outspoken honesty of the junior member for Bedeque, who, I think, admitted
that he saw no means by which we might keep out.
MR. CALLBECK.- As regards the
recklessness charged against the late Government, I think if the matter is examined
into, it will be found that the recklessness was not all on one side. It was stated
that the road would not be more than 120 miles long from Alberton to Georgetown, and
that the cost would not exceed £5,000 per mile, while I think the Leader of the Government
said ££6,000 per mile would cover the whole cost of the road. Now these calculations
were made on the supposition that the distance would not exceed 120 miles. I said
then I believed the road would cost £800,000, but my statement was laughed at. It
is now admitted that the road will cost three and one quarter millions of dollars,
which shows that when I based my calculations on the number of miles then given, that
I was nearer the mark than than the hon. member, was in his estimate. Certainly I
was much nearer to it than the hon. member the Leader of the Government was in his
calculations for land damages. Now, if these able financiers made such mistakes when
there was no inducemtoent for them to do so, in order to get their supporters to
vote for the measure, I can only come to the conclusion that in these respects they
were just as ignorant as men whose opinions they seemed to despise. If, however,
the Leader of the Government is going to endeavor to get a branch line of the Railway
to Rustico, he shall have my support in that matter. But when I find his disposition
is now to find fault with
1873PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER.115
the late Government for contracting for the New London, Victoria, and other bridges,
so much required in those parts of the country, I have little hope that he intends
to exert himself much for the benefit of the people of Rustico. The subscription for
some of the bridges and local works referred to are considerable, the payment of some
of them over a period of of two or three years, while some have paid up the first
instalment already. But it is not specially my duty to refer to these matters. There
are hon. members on this side of the House who are quite capable of doing so. At
all events in the Terms brought down, from the statistics I have read, it will be
seen, that there is a balance in our favor sufficient to cover the cost of some of
these works. The Terms now offered are in excess of those of 1869, and not as the
hon. member attempted to show, $89,000 less. The hon. member does not attempt to
show now that the Railway will pay working expenses, or that it is worth the cost
of its construction. We have Terms offered that are just to Prince Edward Island.
By accepting them we do justice to those we represent, while acceding also to the
expressed desire of her Majesty's Government, by going with the Dominion to share
in her honors, and participate in her reverses. No doubt we will yet if we go in,
have to contribute our proportion towards the defences of the Dominion of Canada,
and in case of war or invasion, be called upon to bear our fair share of the burden..
As the population increases so will the taxes. It is found to be so in all new countries.
Hence in so far as we are concerned it will be the same, in that respect whether we
go into or remain out of Confederation. If in the Union we will have our advantages,
we shall also have to put up with disadvantages. I believe that according to our
population we can bear as much taxation as they can in the Dominion.
Our soil is as good, and our people as industrious and economical as theirs are, and,
therefore, in that respect we can bear our lot just as well as they can. While the
people of Canada have as great an aversion to high taxes as a people can have, I do
not see what we have to dread from a union with the Dominion on the score of increased
taxation. Unquestionably if we remain out of Confederation, our taxes will have to
be raised fifty per cent higher than they are at present.
Mr. BEER.---Sir, I did not expect the discussion on the motion to go into committee on the
dispatches would have continued so long. But as the hon. members on both sides have
gone into the matter so fully, I feel called upon to offer a few remarks. I already
stated that I ran my election on the Terms brought down by hons, Mr. Haythorne and
Laird, and was returned to this House to vote for accepting them. In any of the arguments
advanced in favor of sending up another delegation to seek for better Terms still,
I have failed to see that they have any grounds to hope that they will succeed in
obtaining better than those already offered. Statements have been made here which
are not correct, and have obviously been brought forward to mystify the House. Still.
if better Terms can be had, I am sure no one will be more pleased than I will be.
I have become a Confederate from necessity, not from choice, while I hold the opinion
now which I did three years ago, that, were it not for the Railroad and the heavy
burden it has imposed upon the country, this Island would be under no necessity to
appear at the Bar of the Privy Council if Canada, seeking for admission. No doubt
the Bill was passed with that intent, and the gentleman who told me he felt easy respecting
the matter after it was carried, did no more than express the
116
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 1873
the hon. members wanted. the support
of the Eastern members, failing to
secure that he lost all interest in the
extension of the branch lines. Again,
objection has been taken to the amount
paid for the Boat which runs to Southport. Well, I do not think the hon.
member will gain much credit to himself on that score. Are those who live
on the south side of the Hillsborough
going to see all the revenue expended
in building Railways in which they
have no direct interest, and when they
ask for the convenience of a suitable
Ferry Boat to enable them to reach
the capital are they to be denied?
Are we to be told we have no right
to such accommodation ? Such arguments won't do. Again, if the Branches
did cost nigh $1,000 a mile more than
the Main Line, the material is to
be so much better, that the contractors
will not make so much money out of
it as they will on the Main Line. The
Light Houses, Drill Sheds, &c, will
form the basis of a poor ground of
argument, on our behalf, for better
terms, as the hon. member will find
when he gets to Ottawa. The report
of the inspecting Engineers was not
received until September, while the
maps, &c., did not come to hand until
some considerable time afterwards.
The correspondence did not close until
the 6th of November, so that the late
government were wrongly accused in
the matter. I would like to know Mr.
Speaker, if the Report exonerates the
former Government from blame, in
the matter of the wire fence? The
Engineers were asked to report upon
the sufficiency of the wire fence. Just
allow me to read their reply:—" Respecting the sufficiency of the wire
fence, of which you have doubt, we
suggested in our. report, certain modes
of increasing its strength, which we
think will make it adequate to protect
the line." This is in the last reply.
In the former report they say :—" If
the .government are satisfied that the:
doubts respecting the sufficiency of this
fence are well founded; measures
should be taken to make it of adequate
strength." I question if there is a
little school boy in the country who
would not have given a more direct
and satisfactory answer to the question
than this. To that, if we are to judge
of the report by the answer given to
the enquiry respecting the wire fence,
it is simply not worth the paper it is
written on. With regard to McNeill's
Tender for the construction of the
Branch lines the government did a
good thing for the country by not
accepting it. He actually, by his Tender, wished to obtain for grading the
Road $150,000 or $50,000 more than
it would cost, while he only offered us
securityfor $100,000: He either did
not know his business, or he was
trying to take an advantage of the
Government. The hon. member for
Summerside referred to the alteration
of the Station at Summerside, and said
he thought a supporter of the . government was aware of tbat, before it was
generally known, and used that knowledge to his advantage in disposing
of some lots of land, before the knowledge he possessed respecting the alteration
was generally known. All I
can say in reply to that matter is, that
the removal of the station was pretty
generally spoken of for a considerable
time before it took place. The hon.
member said further that the Hon.
Mr. Haythorne promised that he would
not do anything in the matter of confederation without consulting his constituents.
But Mr. Haythorne's action
in that matter has been endorsed by
the constituents he represents. He is
therefore free of all blame in the matter. It was next asked why the
contract was kept back so long before it was completed respecting the
Branch Lines? My answer to that is,
that an unlooked for spell of stormy
weather prevented the members of the:
Government to get in from the country earlier. That I believe was the
chief reason why the matter was de
1873 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 117 layed so long. The hon. member for
Alberton said that were it not for the
money circulated in building the Railway last year he did not know what
the country would have done for exchange. Well if there is any force in
that argument, if two years hence, or at
any future time a financial pressure is
likely to happen, we will only have to
enter into another Railway speculation,
when we would obtain what exchange
we might require. No doubt the object the hon. member had in view was
to shew that messrs. Haythorne and
Laird were not the men whom the
late Government should have sent to
Ottawa. They, of course were not
the men the hon. member would
have selected. Last year we heard a
good deal about the Tracadie estates,
and of the hardships tenants had to
contend with. For my part I believe
it is worth going into Confederation,
if it is for no other reason than the
certainty that exists by so doing of
relieving these people out of their
present, almost, state of bondage. As
to the delegation now going up to
Ottawa, I have no faith that they
will receive any better Terms than
those already offered. I am strongly
of the opinion that in going up again
they will place themselves and the
Island in a false position. Still, it is
not impossible but that something
better may be obtained, and if so, I
will hold myself free to support them.
I hope soon to hear my hon. colleague
come out against Confederation. Certainly during the election I thought
he ran as an anti-Confederate, and
will only be disappointed if he does
not join in supporting the hon. member for Bedéqiie in his anti-Confederate Resolution.
Hon. F. KELLY.-My hon. colleague referred to what I said during the canvass of the last election.
I did not say I thought we could keep out of a union with Canada. What I did say
was, that I would use my exertions
to get better Terms, and make a better
bargain than the one agreed to by the
late delegates . With respect to the
Tracadie estate, I was the first who, in
this House brought in a Bill for the
relief of these people, and if I had
been here last year I would not have
allowed the measure to have been disposed of so easily. I contend the late
Government did not dea1 justly with
the tenants on that estate. If the Bill
I brought forward, and which was disposed of by the late Government, last
Session, had been sustained, it would
have relieved them from their present
embarrassing condition. With respect
to the motion before the hon. House, I
am free to vote on it as I please, and
when the proper time comes I will do
so. I do not wish to find too much
fault with the Opposition, or their
actions when they were in power,
but still I do believe if the Government; which brought in the Railway
Bill has been left in power, the country wonld not to day be in its present
position.
MR. STEWART.—Mr. Speaker, I
have listened with considerable attention to the speeches of hon. members
on the Government side of the House,
and am sorry to say I have heard no
tangible arguments advanced why we
should support the motion. I listened
last evening to the speech of the hon.
member from Alberton, but am bound
to say it was remarkable for nothing
but its length. He told us he had
been Chancellor of the Exchequer
for four years, and I sat patiently
for the Oracle to open his lips and
shew some good reason why this hon.
House should consent to send another
delegation to Ottawa. I expected a
rare treat, but was most thoroughly
disappointed. The hon. member, the
Leader of the Government in the way
in which he placed the matter before
the country, did so in a very illusory
manner. Yet the hon. member thinks
his mere assertions ought to convince
this side of the House that we should
118
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTERR. 1873
support a second delegation to Ottawa
We might do so if we saw any just
grounds for doing so, for I can assure
the hon. member we have no disposition to other than plume our wings
and raise ourselves above party and
party strife, for the common weal.
We are disposed to deal with the
question wholly and entirely upon its
merits. Such being the disposition of
this side of the House, we have waited
to hear reasons advanced which might
induce us to support the motion, but
as yet no arguments have been brought
forward that are of any value. They
have utterly failed to open up a single
one that is sufficient to induce one
member on this side to vote for the
motion. The hon. member said he
wished a delegation to go up supported by a strong resolution of this
House. Well I suppose he would like
to have all the credit of bringing about
Confederation. Unless he has grounds
upon which to found an argument, and
reason to suppose he will succeed in
arranging better Terms of union, I
hold it unworthy of the hon. member
to think of having this House adjourned for any such a purpose. To
ask this House to adjourn in order that
the Leader of the Government may,
in this matter, be placed in a higher
position than he now occupies, when no
advantage is to accrue to the country
by the act is simply wrong. In
looking at this question, we have to
consider the cause which has forced
us into our present position. Was it
brought about by the Railway or
otherwise? Whatever answer may
be given to the question, it is agreed by
all that Confederation must be carried,
or the business of the country cannot
be carried on. Hence Confederation
appeals now, not to our party feelings,
but to our patriotism. Although they
claim to have on their side the whole
of the political, mercantile, and financial ability of the Colony, yet I can
tell the hon. member from Alberton,
and the Leader of the Government as
well, that there are men on this side
of the House quite capable of competing with them. The delegates,
whom the late Government sent up to
negotiate for terms of union, are men
which they cannot give instructions to.
Nor do I feel that they are the men
either, to give instructions to the men
who sent me here. And I maintain
further, that the late Government
managed the public affairs of the
Colony as well, and better too, than
those whom they superseded. While
my hon. colleague, in his speech, has
refuted the arguments of those of the
Government side to whom he so ably
replied. There is, I believe, as much
money in the Treasury now, including
what is funded abroad, as there was
when they came into power. And,
notwithstanding what has been said
respecting the Dashaway policy, I
contend the money appropriated by the
late Government was expended for
legitimate purposes. If there ever
was a Dashaway policy inaugurated
by any Government, it was when the
Railway Bill was introduced. Not
the Branch Bill of the late party, but
the Dashaway Bill of the Government now in power. Were it not to
me as clear as noonday that our duty
is to accept of Confederation, and that
there is no prospect of obtaining better
Terms, I would not for a moment oppose the motion of the hon. member.
But believing as I do, that full justice
has been done by the Privy Council
of the Dominion of Canada in the
Terms agreed to, I will not, by my
vote, attempt to take any advantage of
the Canadian Ministry. If the Terms
are fair and honest in every particular,
then our duty is to accept them. I
am surprised that hon. members on
the Government side of this hon-
House should have made any reference to the manner in which the delegates left this
Island when they went
up to Ottawa. Neither the Government nor the delegates have any cause
for shame for any change which might
1873 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 119
have taken lace in their minds resigning Confederation. As the annual
accounts came in, the Government
became more fully convmced that one
of two courses would have at once to
be taken—either go into Confederation on reasonable Terms if they could
be had, or to increase the taxes greatly
in advance of what they now are, during this Session of the Legislature.
No other course lay before them, and
for the satisfactory manner in which
they have paved the way for an admission into the Dominion, they deserve much credit.
I am not one of
those who am a Confederate from
necessity. I can look forward with
pleasure to the time when we shall
form a part of the great Dominion,
which extends from the Atlantic to
the Pacific. I see before me a great
territory, rich in agriculture, mineral,
and resources for mechanical improvement, not excelled in any part of the
world. Why Sir, we are about uniting with a country of which we may
justly feel proud; with a people who
have sprung from the same race, speak
the same language; who are governed
by the same laws, and who are animated with the same hopes and desires as we chen'sh
among ourselves.
Why then should we have any horrors
about Confederation? I am, therefore,
sorry that the hon. Leader of the
Government should think of pursurng
a course which will only add delay
and expense, without producing any
beneficial results to the Colony. But
I suppose the hon. member from Alberton wishes to play his last act in the
comedy. I can well imagine with
what solicitude the hon. member wrll
set out on his mission. Even now I
can fancy I see him before the Privy
Council, pleading, with sorrow depicted
in his countenance, and tears tlowrng
from his eyes, for his country, and an
additional allowance to pay for the
Breakwater at Tignish Run. (Laughter.) Yes, pleading that the Drill-
sheds, Lighthouses, and other similar
works may be taken into account and
paid for; assurring them that when
this is done our people will fold their
hands and peacefully sit down under
the shade of the maple tree of the Dominion of Canada. But Sir, I cannot
see why we should wish to force unfair claims from Canada, as if we had
any right to live upon the generosrty
of other people. We all know that
for internat improvements, the people
of Canada have to tax themselves.
Education and many local wants are
all provided for by their municipalities.
And to this we will also have to come
too. I have carefully examined into
the matter, and having done so, do not
feel that I can vote for sending up
another delegation. As Col. Gray
said, the Terms are exceedingly good,
and I have heard no argument advanced to convince me that it is our
duty to reject them. It is said that
the Bay de Verte Canal will be of advantage to this Island, and one hon.
member thinks we should pay a proportion of its cost. I admit. that if it
was open it would be an indirect benefit to this Island. It would open up a
direct road to the Bay of Fundy,
which would be a great matter to us,
and doubtless we would reap some
advantages from its construction. It
is thought by some that its cost will
not exceed $500,000, while others are
of opinion it will cost much more.
But it is not yet built, and may not for
many a day. It may not be built at
all. The fact is, Mr. Speaker, they
have brought forward no arguments.
We have been contending with shadows, and have taken the ground from
under their feet. It is not wisdom to
keep up this discussion much longer.
If this delegation goes up, m all probability the matter will be staved off
for another year. This is not desirable. The business of the country is
now embarrassed. Trade is encumbered with many difficulties. All this
would be relieved if Confederation was
effected. That is one reason why I
120
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 1873
am so anxious that no unnecessary
delay should take place.
The hon. the SPEAKER then put the
motion, which being carried in the
affirmative, the House resolved itself
into a Committee of the whole House
on the further consideration of the
despatches.
Hon Mr. Pope—Mr. Chairman, I
beg leave to move the following Resolution :
Whereas, the question of Confederation of this Island with the Dominion
of Canada, having formed the subject
of negotiations between the Dominion
of Canada and the late Executive
Council of this Colony, the correspondence interchanged between His Excellency the
Governor General and His
Honor the Lieut. Governor of this
Island, and the members of the Privy
Council of Canada and this Island,
embodying certain terms and conditions relating to the proposed union,
having been officially laid before the
House and duly considered. The
House is of opinion that said terms
and conditions do not secure to this
Colony a sum sufficient to defray the
ordinary and indispensable requirements of its local government, and are
by no means an equivalent for the
Revenue, present and prospective,
which it would be called upon to surrender to the Dominion.
And, Whereas. The strong objections hitherto entertained by the peo.
ple of this Island to Confederation,
having been much modified, and the
present House of Assembly feeling
anxious to meet the desire of Her
Majesty's lmperial Government to unite
under one Government, all the .British
possessions in America, is willing in
good faith and loyaly to merge the
interests of the inhabitants of Prince
Edward Island with those of their
fellow subjects in the Dominion, on
terms which are just and reasonable,
and such as will not involve the people of this Island in direct local taxation for
objects for which the ordinary
Revenue has hither to enabled them to
provide.
Resolved Therefore, That this House
being most desirous to secure, to the
people of Prince Edward Island on
entering the union, just and reasonable
terms, does hereby authorize His
Honor. the Lieutenant Governor to
appoint delegates to proceed at once
to Ottawa to confer with the Government of the Dominion of Canada, on
this great and important subject with
a full confidence that the terms to
which they will agree, will be such as
will insure their immediate and
unqualified ratification by the Legisture of the Colony.
As the night is somewhat advanced I
am willing the matter should lay over
for consideration until another day, I,
therefore, move that the Speaker take
the chair, the Chairman report progress, and ask leave to sit again.
On motion of the
Hon. LEADER OF
THE GOVERMENT, the House resolved
itself into a committee of the whole to
resume the consideration for the despatches relating to Confederation.
Hon. LEADER OF THE GOVERNMENT.—This opportunity of securing
union with the. Dominion of Canada,
on just and favorable terms should not
be lost. I am prepared to table a
resolution to appoint a delegation for
the purpose of seeking better Terms,
and expect support from both sides of
this House. There can be nothing
lost by endeavoring to secure the best
Terms, as we fully believe and feel that
under the present offer we have not
sufficient for the maintenance of our
local. Government. By the Imperial
or, North American Act, we shall be
prevented from making any demand
1873 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 121
upon the Dominion Government after
entering the Union, and we are therefore, anxious to secure such Terms
before accepting Confederation, as
will enable us to get along without
being compelled to resort to immediate,
direct taxation. If the delegation
should fail, we shall be in no worse
position than at present; but I have
not the slightest doubt that more
liberal Terms will be conceded to us.
It is a matter that will affect our people for all time, and if reasonable
Terms are obtained, they will be re
lieved from a certain amount of taxation. If, on the other hand, no better
Terms can be procured, it will be for
the Legislature to determine what it is
prepared to do. If reasonable Terms
are offered us, I am satisfied that both
sides will be prepared to accept them,
and to consummate the union as soon
as possible. I know the Opposition
regret that a split has not taken place
on this side of the House, as they desired, but we should all unite for the
common interest of our country, and
consummate the union as soon as possible, by procuring and accepting
reasonable Terms.
Mr. D. LAIRD.—As the resolution
submitted by his honor the Leader of
the Government relates to an important matter, due notice should have
been given of its introductlon. It contains statements, which, I think, are
not borne out by the facts of the case.
The statement that the Terms now
offered us do not meet the wants of
this Colony, is, in my opinion, an altogether erroneous one, and hon. members on the
Government side of the
House have not produced arguments
to substantiate it. The argument that
because our wants are great, we are
entitled to better Terms, seems to me
a very poor one. Why are the Terms
before us insufficient? We have been allowed $20 per head more than any
of the other Provinces of the Dominion, on account of our isolated
position, which is certainly a great
favor. The claim we preferred was
much larger than the sum we received,
but we were told plainly by the Dominion Government that they would
grant no more, and that they considered they had dealt fairly with us.
When we (the delegates) met the
committee of the Privy Council, and
stated our demands, we were told that
we were to have a conference
with the Finance Minister on the
following day, and were directed
to present our claims to him, in order
to show how we could base them.
Our arguments were not taken on our
mere word, as we had to show the
why and the wherefore for every demand we made. We met the Finance
Minister, presented our claims and
showed that on account of our isolation,
during nearly six months in the year,
we could not receive the benefits of
their public works, and were entitled
to a full equivalent for all the Dominion debt, present and prospective.
The Finance Minister acknowledged
our statements to be ingenious, and
next day we presented our case before
the Privy Council. The latter said
that some of the positions we took
were inadmissible, and could not be
entertained, that our arguments on
these matters were not such as they
could place before their Parliament for
approval, and that unless they could
uphold our claims in the face of the
whole Dominion, they could not grant
them. They told us they were willing
to go as far as lay in their power, just
so far as—in the words of the Finance
Minister—not to upset their own apple
cart. They conceive that they have
conceded to us the most liberal Terms
they can carry through Parliament,
and that is also the expression of
numerous journals, and of outside
opinion generally, throughout the Dominion. If arguments are to be based
upon our wants, and not upon our
rights, they will amount to nothing at
122
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 1873
all, and I fear will meet with but poor
success. If our Island Legislature had
from the first husbanded its Revenues,
there would have been plenty for centuries to come, but they went into extravagant
expenditures in building a
Railway, and thus placed as in the
present positibn of embarassment.
They expended just like a lady who
spent so much money upon her dress
that her husband could not buy a
plough. If we have become embarassed by entering into a great enterprise,
what is that to the Dominion Government? Is our extravagance any argument for better
Terms? The Government have not, so far, shown that
$45 per head of our population is not
a liberal allowance, and cannot do so.
The hon. Leader of the Government
tried to make out that something had
been overlooked in reckoning the present and prospective debt of the Dominion, that
ten millions of dollars had
been expended on the Intercolonial
Railway last'year, which had not been
taken into account. Here is the statement of the Finance Minister in his
Budget Speech :—"I would now, for a
few moments, call your attention to the
financial position of the Dominion. I
have no doubt that every hon. member who has examined the public accounts, will have
read the statements,
showing the Debt of the Dominion,
and the expenditures on capital account, with the greatest satisfaction,
for they show that during the last five
years there has been paid out of surplus revenue, over and above ordinary
charges on the consolidated revenue
fund, and contributed towards the construction of public works that were
chargeable to the capital, a sum of
$9,522,000." "It will be seen by the
estimates that it is proposed to ask the
House for a total expenditure of $31,
008,433. This includes the expenditures authorized by statute for construction of
public works and all other
charges. Of this sum $9, 974,240
will be chargeable to capital ; railroads
(Intercolonial) $4,335,240; canals $5,277,000; public buildings, including the
Library and grounds, $362,000; making a total of $9,974,240; also deduct
from the expenditure $93,000 in payment of debts; this leaves to be provided for during
the coming year, out
of income $29,941,183." The hon.
Leader of the Government would endeavor to make out that something had
been overlooked in calculating the
debt of the Dominion, but he cannot
prove his statement, as he has nothing
upon which to base an argument. Ten
millions more expended on the Intercolonial up to the first of January last,
and every dollar of that sum was included in our calculation. For every
dollar expended on the Intercolonial
Railway we are to receive a share,
when we receive $45 per head. The
hon. Leader of the Government says
that some of our Lighthouses and all
our Drill Sheds have. been erected
since the Quebec Scheme was agreed
upon, and that we are entitled to receive their value from the Dominion
Government. He should remember
that the debt of the Dominion to day
is not more than $25 per head, and,
judging from their increase of population, is not likely to exceed that
amount, while we receive $20 over
and above that sum. The little appeal
for the cost of Lighthouses and Breakwaters will not succeed in the face of
these facts. I never heard a more
flimsy argument from a Leader of a
Government asking the House for
another delegation. Why, he has not
shown a shadow ofa shade of a reason
for his present course of action. In
their Minute of Council they do not
even state that they agree to pay us
for our Post Office, because there was
not a Post Office in the other Provinces which had been used as such,
which was paid for by the Dominion
Government. Our building is mentioned in the Terms as the Law Courts
and Registry Office, so careful were
they in wording their document. If
1873 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 123
we had advocated remuneration for a
long catalogue of Lighthouses, Drill
Sheds, &c., built since the Quebec
Scheme was agreed upon, how could
they present such matters before their
Parliament for payment, when the
other Provinces were not paid for
similar works? They have a vigorous
Opposition, Sir, and while on account
of our isolated position we have a
right to some special claims to make
our position equal to theirs, we have
no right to press any unreasonable
demands. We had no claim on the
Dominion for the loss of our lands;
but we presented our casein this way:
We stated that as our Island had been
granted away by the British Government, we had no Crown lands from
which to derive a Revenue; Ontario
had her Crown lands and forests, and
had received an income of a million of
dollars from them, while we had no
such means at our command. Nova
Scotia has mines, and New Brunswick mines and forests, and we
contended that we could not run an
equal race with them, and were, therefore, entitled to something to compensate us
for the loss of our lands. If
we never expend the principal granted
us by the Dominion, we can draw the
interest at five per cent, and the sum
thus received will be equal to the
amount per head received by the other
Provinces from their lands. They
said that this was a matter which they
could lay before their Parliament, for
which they could show some reason,
for they could not expect us to pay
dollar for dollar in taxes with them,
unless placed on the same footing. I
cannot see how we can press our
claims merely on account of our necessity or poverty. We, on this Opposition side
of the House, wish to know
whereon the Government can base
their claims for additional concessions
from Candaa, when we have already
received such a liberal allowance. We
have some honor and dignity to maintain in this matter, and have no right
to send off a begging delegation to Ottawa for new Terms. The Colony has already obtained
Terms which the Governor General has declared cannot be increased, and I, for one,
cannot stultify myself in supporting the resolution in favor of another delegation
at present, as the Government have shown no good reason for it. The only argument
adduced by the Government and their supporters is that the amount we should receive
from the Dominion under the present Terms would not meet our wants. If new delegates
are sent to up to Ottawa, they will find that the Canadian Government will analyse
our Revenue under
those Terms, and will find their statements incorrect. The School system
of Canada is chiefly supported by local
taxation, while our system is wholly
supported from public funds; they
would, therefore, never concede to us
sufficient to meet our educational
wants from the Treasury, while they
pay local taxes for a similar purpose.
Three-fourths of the expenditure of
the Board of Works in the Dominion,
for building litte bridges and meeting
other small local wants, is not borne
by the local Government, but by the
muncipalities. For the reasons I have
already given, I cannot support the
resolution introduced by the hon.
Leader of the Government. I see no
reason for delay or for sending another.
delegation to Canada; it will require,
probably, at least three weeks, as they
cannot rush everything through at
Ottawa, and the whole Privy Council
is not prepared to dance attendance
upon them. The Dominion Parliament is now in session, and, therefore,
the Government will have precious
little time to devote to the delegation
Every hour's delay is injuring the
trade of this Colony, and merchants
scarcely know whether to import
goods or not, as they are not sure of
being able to obtain exchange to pay
for them. Under our present system
our duties come in to meet our present
124
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 1873
wants, but when we form a part of the
Dominion, we shall receive our allowance in advance. This will cause
plenty of exchange for the first few
years, at least, and will help trade to
go on smoothly. The local Government
will have no local debt, and we shall
be' able to begin with clean books. I
had some doubt at first that Confederation would work well under the
British Constitution, unless the Provinces became more prosperous than
they had been ; but I am now happy
to acknowledge that the Dominion, as
a Government, has been a greater
success than I ever anticipated, or its
promoters expected. This can be
proved most clearly. I will read a
statement from Mr. Tilley's speech,
which will show their position and
prospects : "Now, having dealt with
this point, I trust the House will pardon me for a few moments if I refer
to the future with reference to our
liabilities and engagements and our
prospects of meeting those liabilities.
In doing so, I must again refer to the
past, and I will do it in a very few
words. We have an annual surplus,
after meeting all engagements and
providing the necessary sinking fund,
sufficient to pay the interest on a debt
of $30,000,000 more than the debt
now is. We have in the present year
a Surplus, without taking into account
the sinking fund, amounting to something like three quarters of a million.
We are, however, entering upon new
and increased engagements, involving
a very large sum of money. We are
entering upon works—we have already
done so—which will require a large
increase of our debt. We have $10,000,000 to expend on the Intercolonial
Railway. We have $30,000,000 for
the Canadian Pacific, and the Canal
system, that has been accepted by the
Government, will involve an expenditure of at least $20,000,000. These
are serious matters, inasmuch as they
add $60,000,000 to our existing debt.
Let us now see what is the annual
charge involved in this matter. In
the first place we have available the
Imperial guarantee for £2,500,000
sterling, given to us in lieu of the
Fenian claims. Then we have a
guarantee of £1,500,000 for the construction of the Intercolonial Railway.
We have also a guarantee of £300,000
for the North West territories, and I
may state to the House that the Imperial Government has assented to the
transfer of the fortifications guarantee
of £1,100,000 to be expended in the
enlargement and construction of our
canals, and in the construction of the
Pacific Railway. (Cheers.) Thus
we have a total amount guaranteed of
£5,400,000 or $26,000,000 which we
can obtain at an interest off our percent.
On that item alone, we have, therefore, an annual charge of $1,040,000,
and on the $34,000,000 remaining, the
annual charge, at five per cent, will
be $1,700,000. For the sinking fund
of one per cent, we require $600,000,
and for commission on interest $27,400, making a total annual charge,
when these works are completed, of
$3,367,400." They are paying less
per contage of interest to-day than
they ever paid, and it is lessening year
after year. I must acknowledge that
Confederation, as a political scheme,
has been successful far beyond my expectations. Things looked dark at the
the time of the Quebec Scheme, and it
actually appeared at that time that
several prominent men in their Government came down here for assistance because they
could not carry out
their Government at home. The
seven per cents and six per cents of
old Canada have all vanished, and the
highest interest now paid is only five
per cent. One of the arguments of
the hon. Leader of the Government is
that we are not, under the present
Terms, going to receive an equivalent
for what we are to give up. Instead
of their taking away anything, we shall
receive more than the Revenue collected by them on this Island. As
1873 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 125
time rolls on the manufactures of the
Dominion will increase, and we shall
import more and more of their goods,
which will greatly reduce the amount
of duties collected here. Many of the
American manufacturers have moved
across the border into Canada, and
have established manufactures of
mowing machines and agricultural
implements. All these and a great
variety of other manufactures will
likely increase, and intercolonial trade
will so increase, that instead of Canada
taking away money for duties collected
here, it will be far otherwise. I believe they will get no more revenue
from this Colony ten years hence than
they will this year, if we enter the
Dominion. The taxation of the Dominion at present amounts to only
$3.54 per head, while ours will
amount to $6 per head when the
whole Railway debt falls upon us, if
we remain out of Confederation. The
Opposition have a right to know
whether it is the intention of the hon.
Leader of the Government to ask the
Dominion to give us back the Railway, and to make it a local work for
this Island or not. If it is going to
pay $50,000 per year over working
expenses, as stated by the hon. member for Alberton, it would pay us to
work it ourselves. I am sure the
Government can get it back by telegraphing to Ottawa, without taking
the trouble to send up a delegation. But the hon. Leader of the
Government has never breathed a
syllable in reference to taking back
the Railway, and working it ourselves.
It was all very well to cry out at
Election times that the Railway is
worth what it costs but he has not a
word to say now about asking the Dominion to give it back to us, although
he knows they would be willing to do
so. I believe he will be only too glad
to allow the Dominion to keep it, as
he knows it will not pay its working
expenses for four or five years at least. At the end of that time the spruce
sleepers will require to be removed,
and where will the money come from
to do this? Even the working expenses will not be paid by the earnings of the road
! I see that the Nova
Scotia Railway, to this day, has not
nearly paid its working expenses, and
the New Brunswick Railway has only
paid a small per centage on its cost.
The people do not want the Railway
back, but look upon it as a happy thing
that the Dominion have agreed to take
it and pay for it, and that they will
be able to get along in their usual way
without that burden. Many hon.
members will soon require to go home
to their farms and sow their seeds ;
but instead of proceeding with the
business of the country as is required,
we shall have a recess for two or
three weeks, and will require to meet
again at the very busiest portion of
the spring season. Unless the Government can show some ground for
their claims, they will most egregiously tail before the Dominion Government—mere
mendicant claims will
not be recognized by them. A great
many of the Canadians are of the
opinion that we are better off than
they are, and that we are just as able
to pay our debts. Perhaps the Dominion Government will give the new
delegation a little more for pity's sake,
to get them out of their way, but it
will be only a more trifle, if anything
at all. The more manly and straightforward counts would be to carry the
question through the House in good
faith with Canada, without delay; there
is no time to lose. As I went to the
people on these terms, I am now prepared to do my duty to my constituents and the
country by giving them
my support. I therefore move the
following amendment :—
Whereas, This House has had under consideration certan papers relating to the Confederation
of this island
with the Dominion of Canada, and
more particularly a despatch of His Excellency the Governor General,
126
PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 1873
dated the 14th of March last, transmitting to His Honor Lieut. Governor
Robinson, the copy of a report of a
Committee of the Honorable the Privy
Council of Canada, approved of by His
Excellency in Council, on the 10th of
the said month, which report contains
minutes of Conference between the
said Committee of the Privy Council,
and delegates from the Government of
Prince Edward Island, on the subject
of the Union of this Colony with the
Dominion of Canada.
And Whereas, By a Telegraphic
Despatch from the Governor General,
dated the 12th of March last, His Excellency, with respect to the terms of
Confederation contained in said minutes of Conference, signifies his Ministers' opinion—an
opinion in which he
fully coincides—that "no additional
concessions would have any chance of
being accepted by the Parliament of
Canada.
And Whereas, It is highly desirable
that this question of Union should be
carried by the Legislature of this
Island with as little delay as possible,
in view of the financial and commercial necessities of the Colony.
Therefore, Resolved, That this
House do appoint a Committee of
seven to prepare an address to the
Queen, praying Her Majesty in Council to pass an order in conformity with
the 14th section of "British North
American Act, 1867," uniting Prince
Edward Island with the Dominion of
Canada, on the terms and conditions
approved of in the minute of the Privy
Council of Canada, on the 10th of
March, 1872.,
Hon. LEADER OF THE GOVERNMENT.—The hon. member for Belfast
stands up here and asks why the Government do not state whether they intend to ask
the Dominion to give us
back our Railway? Well, I ask why
he did not let the country know what
Terms he intended to ask from Canada,
before starting on that delegation ? He
stole away, because he knew the late
Government were defeated before he
went ; and yet he stands up here and
declares it is our duty to let him know
what we intend to ask in addition to
the Terms he obtained ! He admits
that he wanted to entrap and ensnare
the people into Confederation, and is
most anxious that the Terms brought
down by himself he accepted at once.
When he states that I will go to Canada begging some small concession, he
forgets the sneaking, contemptible
manner, in which he left his country, to
hand it over to the Dominion, without
the knowledge or consent of any person outside the late Government. He
gained his position in the last House
by lying and slander ; and by printing
and circulating a speech, made at St.
Dunstan's College, by his political
opponent, and by lying and misrepresentation in reference to the School
Question, he obtained a seat in the
present House. There would not
have been three men of the late Government party returned to this House
on the Terms before us, or the policy
of the late Government, if the School
Question had not be dragged into their
assistance, and made to do them service. The complimentary speech,
made by the hon. Col. Gray, was circulated in Raasa, Rona and Belle
Creek, and the people were duped ;
but if the copies of that speech had
been circulated among more intelligent
people, and his election had depended
upon the result, he would never have
obtained a seat in this House. During the last year, while he was in
power, he spent some $13,000 for
which the Accounts do not show that
the country received anything in return. I hope I have too much regard
for my character and for my country,
to undertake a mission of this kind,
unless I felt and believed that far
better Terms, than those now offered
us, can be obtained. I shall endeavor
to do all loan, and I have not the
slightest doubt of our getting better
1873 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 127
Terms. I believe it will be sour
grapes for the hon. junior member for
Belfast, if we do get anything in addition to the Terms brought down by
He will find that notwithstanding his extraordinary exertions,
this question will be carried, and the
delegates appointed. I did not take
the School Question to the people and
make political capital out of it ; but I
do not hesitate to say that the hon.
jun. member for Belfast and his friends
owe their seats in this House to the
prejudices which they aroused in their
several districts, on that question.
The hon. member says that the present
Terms are sufficient, and that no argument can be brought to show that we
should have better Terms. We have
no wilderness lands unsettled, to depend upon as a source of Revenue ; no
mines, no minerals, no forests ; and,
therefore, the allowance we shall receive from the Dominion wlll be almost a fixed
one for all time to come.
When we give up our right to levy
duties on goods imported, we surrender
an increasing Revenue for a fixed one,
which will be certain, in the course of
a very few years, to fall far short of
our requirements. Is the Revenue
offered us in the present Terms an
equivalent to the increasing one we
surrender ? I maintain that it is not.
The hon. member credits the Dominion
with our miscellaneous items ; but he
will find that under our Government
we shall always have a list of items not
enumerated in the Terms, which must
be paid for out of our local Revenue.
I now repeat what I stated on a former
occasion, viz: that if the $800,000 be
invested in the purchases of the proprietary lands, not more than two-
thirds of that amount will ever be returned to the Treasury. Some hon.
members of the Opposition put down
the expenditure of the Board of
Works at $56,000 per year. To show
how far below the mark that statement
is, I may state that during the present
year alone, there has been $61,000
spent by that Board.
MR. D. LAIRD—That amount may
be marked upon the books, but a large
portion of it is not yet expanded, as
there are some large bridges which
will not be finished for two years to
come.
Hon. LEADER OF THE GOVERNMENT.—The money is to all intents
and purposes expended. The hon.
member for New London referred to
his " dashaway policy," and endeavoured to show that that statement contained in his
letter did not refer to the
late Government, and that the portion
of that letter which was published in
the newspapers was not a true copy.
Now, I have a copy of that letter in
my possession, and will guarantee its
correctness, and that it is genuine, and
I know that the published portion was
also a correct copy. When we see a
member of a Government reveal his
intentions to Mr. Lawson, that he intended to "dash away, levy taxation,
and run the Government while it will,"
we must come to the conclusion that
he has committed one of the most dishonorable acts of which a man can be
guilty. The very men who charged
the members of the Coalition Government with being dishonest and corrupt,
adopted the dishonest dash away policy.
If ever there were dishonest and unprincipled men entrusted with the
reins of power, it was during the last
twelve months. Their policy was to
"dash away, levy taxation, and to
blame their political opponents for the
results of their actions." Such conduct was surely beneath any right
minded, honorable man, and could not
be justified in any manner whatever.
Many serious charges have been made
by several hon. members of the present
Opposition ; but they have never convicted me of lying and slandering ; and
the Journals of the House do not make
me out a malicious defamer, as they
do the hon.
Leader of the Opposition
128 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 1873
I was never kicked out of a Temperance Society, as he was, for violating an honorable
and sacred pledge. No truthful charge can be made against me of being guilty of falsehood
and slander, of which he has been convicted again and again. The hon. member for New
London thought he made a telling speech, and asked how the country was going to stand
the drain from it to pay the interest on the Railway debt. I answer that £100,000
sterling have been expended in this country in the construction of the Railway, of
which the merchants have received the benefit ; and of that amount only some £800
have been transmitted to London to pay the interest on the Debentures. The construction
of the Steamer
Prince Edward drained more than three times the amount of the whole Railway tax from the Island,
in sterling exchange. Had it not been for the construction of the Railway, every Bank
on the Island would, at one time, have ceased to do business, as was the case with
many in the other Provinces, and there would have been a commercial panic. After the
Railway is completed, if the trade and exports of the Colony do not increase considerably,
there might be some difficulty in procuring exchange, but while the construction of
the Railway is in progress, there can be no difficulty in that respect, so that the
remarks of the hon. member do not apply. There would be no difficulty in raising money
sufficient to pay the interest on the Railway debt as well as all other demands, but
it is not so easy to restore the credit of the country after it has been injured by
the hawking of the Debentures by the late Colonial Secretary. I showed clearly, last
night, in my remarks, that even admitting that the miscellaneous items will be borne
by the Dominion, the present Terms would still be some $70,000 short of meeting the
requirements of the country. Now, I believe that the states
men of Canada are liberal enough not
to ask us to place ourselves in a ruinous position, in which we would be compelled
to resort to local taxation, immediately after accepting Confederation, and becoming
a portion of the Dominion. It would be far better, and more conducive to their interests,
as well as our own, to give us sufficient to make our people contented, prosperous,
and happy. I do not intend to go over the whole ground again ; but I believe we shall
have no difficulty in obtaining better Terms, and that this is a sore spot to the
hon. members of the Opposition. I am not the man who would undertake to go on a begging
expedition ; when I go to ask better Terms I shall go fortified by a resolution from
this House,—I have no intention of sneaking off to Ottawa without the knowledge of
the people, as some before me have done. After the last delegation started, a prominent
member of the late Government declared at a public meeting, in this city, that they
were gone "to fend off" Confederation, while in reality they were gone to seek terms
of union. The only man outside the Government to be trusted with the secrets of their
scheme was "dear Mr. Lawson." I give the hon. member credit for a good deal of shrewdness
and clear-headedness, but I wish I could give him credit for more fair dealing and
less conspiracy. Before those delegates left for Ottawa, it was circulated in St.
John, N B., paper that there was to be a race between Laird for Confederation, and
Pope for the grants for this Island. This precious bit of news was sent there in the
same way as the despatch of the Governor General was suggested from this Island. When
I make this statement, I wish no reflection to be cast on the Governor General as
he was not to blame in any way.
MR. SINCLAIR.—I only wish the hon. Leader of the Government would produce the original letter
written by
1873 PARLIAMENTARY REPORTER. 129
me to Mr. Lawson, in order that I might publish it. The manner in which that letter
was obtained, and used, was the most contemptible I ever heard of. Instead of stating
in that letter that the late Government had determined to dash away, levy taxation,
&c., as represented by his honor, I said that there were men in the country who entertained
different views from my own, and would dash away, levy taxation, &c. I also stated
that the trade that would result from a union with Canada, would be greatly in favor
of this Colony, and that a large quantity of goods from the Dominion would come in
here duty free. The hon. Leader of the Government has produced a mere garbled extract
from that letter. I deny that $61,000 have been expended this year by the Board of
Works. Nothing injured the credit of this Colony more than the action of the Coalition
Government in using the money, raised by the Railway tariff, for general purposes.
Their action was contrary to law, and detrimental to the best interests of the country.
Progress was then reported, and leave obtained to sit again.
House adjourned till ten o'clock this morning.
Cet individu a participé aux :
