11
COMMONSÂ
[Mr. MACDONALD — ] [...] practically so as to suit the needs and interests of the country from time
to time. By a large majority the
Canadian people, not so long ago, gave evidence in a manner so marked, so
decidedly expressed, that no one can gainsay it of their confidence in the
ability of this government to deal with the question of the tariff along
the lines I have indicated.
Another item of great interest to our people is the announcement in the speech of
the
appointment of a commission to act with
one similarly appointed by the United States
government with regard to the preservation
of the rivers and other waterways which are
common to the two great countries. That is a
declaration which I am sure, in this land of
mountain and the lake, and this land of rushing rivers, this land in which our immense
water—powers and waterways are destined to
fill so important a place is one which Will be
welcomed by the House; and the labours of
that commission which was originated by an
Act of Congress passed in 1902, will no doubt
be watched throughout this country with
deep interest and I am confident will result
in good to both nations. No one will gainsay
the statement that Canadians generally regard the maintenance of friendly relations
with the great English speaking people to
the south of us as of prime importance, and
without exception hope that the time will
never come when those friendly relations
may in anyway be impaired or unsettled;
but while that is the case, and while we
are prepared to discuss with them such matters of common interest as I have mentioned,
I am sure that we all cordially endorse the
declaration of the right hon. the First Minister that we will send no more delegations
to Washington just now, to look for trade
favours. We have now reached that stage
when we have become self-reliant and confident in our own resources and great future.
We have implicit reliance in the capabilities
of Canada, and while prepared to favourably consider any proposition in the interests
of both countries, looking towards an improvement in our trade relations, we do not
feel disposed to-day to send any more delegations on the question of reciproc1ty.
The policy announced in the speech of
granting provincial autonomy for the Northwest Territories marks an important epoch
in our history. It is thirty-four years ago
since the province of Manitoba was admitted into confederation and given all those
rights, and that status in the federation
which is enjoyed by every province in the
Dominion, and at this moment it may be opportune to indulge in a retrospective glance
and recall some of the advances and developments that have occurred since confederation.
Thirty—eight years ago when
confederation was established it embraced
but four provinces and covered a territory
stretching between Lake Superior and the
sea. Each one of these provinces was then
imbued mainly by local prejudices and limited by provincial aspirations. Each one
was
12
unacquainted with the other. There was no
common tie save that of the constitution
which bound them together. Our total trade
then amounted to but one hundred and thirty
one million dollars. Our railway mileage was
but two thousand miles and our postal revenue but one million dollars. Our bank deposits
amounted to but thirty-eight million
dollars, and our people generally had but a
limited appreciation of the resources and possibilities then awaiting development.
Our outlook was purely provincial and the aspirations
and ideas of our people were almost exclusively limited by the boundaries of the provinces
in which they lived. It is but just
to bear tribute to the foresight of that great
statesman who presided at the inception of
Canada's birth and who watched over this
country when in her swaddling clothes. We
can all, irrespective of party, regard him as
one who did great things for Canada and
whose name will always be embalmed in the
history of this Dominion. In 1870, when the
Northwest was a seething mass of rebellion
and discontent, the Territories were brought
into confederation. In 1871, British Columbia
entered the union. In 1873 the little island
of Prince Edward followed her example and
in 1875 the Northwest was placed under the
jurisdiction of a lieutenant governor. Then
in 1880 all the British possessions in North
America were placed under the Dominion of
our federal parliament with the exception
of Newfoundland. Then followed the construction of the Canadian Pacific Railway,
which bound all the provinces together and
gave to the eastern provinces a common
interest in the western heritage, and gave
birth to that newer patriotism which has
shown such rapid development in the last
few years. Following the building of this
railway, came new settlements. From all
portions of the habitable globe came settlers
into this new country, so that no less than
three hundred and twenty-four thousand
eight hundred and ninety-eight people during
the past four years have gone into this new
land—a number exceeding the population of
some of our provinces and equalling that of
others. When we stop to consider the fact
also, that during the past four years 94,791
homesteads have been taken up in that country, we can form some conception of the
rapidity of its growth. In those western
territories, which are to be given provincial
autonomy, there exists a country which exceeds in extent the countries of France,
Germany and Italy taken together. This
is indeed a precious heritage, this great
Northwest land, which to-day forms part of
our territory and in which we are about to inaugurate a system of government which
will
place that country on an equal footing with
the other provinces in confederation. Realizing the advantages which Canada offers
to
new settlers, We have men from all lands
and every clime taking up homesteads in
that vast territory, where they will enjoy
constitutional rights and privileges from
13 JANUARY 16, 1905
which they are debarred in lands from
which they come.
The making of this new province, or these
new provinces, as the case may be will establish a continuous line of provinces from
sea to sea, and will, to a certain extent,
round off confederation. As a result of this
growth which I have but roughly outlined,
a great change has been coming over (Canada. Our outlook has widened during the
thirty-eight years that have gone. We have
ceased to view matters from a provincial
or narrow point of view; our outlook has
become a Dominion, a continental one. And,
especially during the last eight years has
this development gone on in so remarkable
a degree that I may be pardoned for referring to it. One of the advantages of this
marked advance of the last eight years is
that old race and creed issues have been forgotten, and from sea to sea men do not
now
stop to consider these things, but we realize
in a way we never did before that we are
Canadians one and all. There is coming to
Canada, but more particularly to young
Canada, a realization of the great resources
and extent of our country which was not
present with us even a few years ago.
When we recall that, in Canada we have an
area that is more than one-third of the
whole British empire, and as that idea has
permeated the whole life of our people,
there has grown a patriotic pride and a
feeling of interest in and devotion to our
country which, in other nations and in
other times, it has required the stern teaching of war to evoke. And our pride in
our
institutions, in our literature, in our rapid
growth in national life, has been enhanced
by our faith in our country's resources, and
by a realization of the fact that during the
past eight years our trade increase has exceeded that of every other country in the
history of the world. I have already given
some figures showing our position at
the time of confederation. To-day, our
railway mileage exceeds 20,000 miles; our
postal revenue is over $6,000,000 a year;
the deposits in our banks instead of being
$38,000,000, as they were thirty-eight years
ago, are close upon $600,000,000. Once
these facts are realized, we contemplate the
position of Canada With growing exultation
and pride. We realize that here in Canada,
we have all the elements by which we may
become the great flour, paper, cheese, butter and provision producer, as well
the great woodenware manufacturing centre of the world. These natural conditions
are beginning to be appreciated, and
are certain of early exploitation. But our
outlook widening, as it has been on the
federal and continental side, looks also toward the imperial field; andI am proud
to
say that I believe there is not in Canada any
desire for any other future than in connection with \the great empire to which we
belong. At the same time, we should remember that he who would artificially or un
14naturally hasten the solution of the problem
of our future relations to the empire may
create the worst stumbling block in the
way of reaching the end which he desires
to see attained. There are those who are
accustomed to say that Canada has done
nothing towards paying her debt of
gratitude to the empire. I think they
forget the efforts that have been put forth
by Canada, and the help that has been rendered by Canada in constructing already
one great transcontinental line and preparing for the immediate construction of
another. The first of these already has
been, and both of them must be, tremendous
factors in binding the empire together, whether in peace or in war. In addition to
that,
Canada has shown herself, by her attitude
at the time of the South African war, to be
ready to stand by the empire in the hour
of national necessity. We are going on
with the inception of a Canadian navy—a '
small navy it may be, but we are moving
along the proper line by arranging that
when Canada spends her money on behalf
of the empire she shall oversee that expen~
diture. It may be true—it is true—that
Canada must make some sacrifices in order
that the problem of the empire may be
solved. Those of us who believe in
imperial connection and the future of the
empire are ready that these sacrifices should
be made. At the same time, Canada's interests must be guarded, and there must be
corresponding sacrifices in every other part
of the empire, in order that a harmonioas
and a successful future may be assured.
The next paragraph of the address to
which I will refer announces that satisfactory progress has been made in carrying
out
the policy of a national transcontinental
railway which was approved by parliament
two years ago and reaffirmed last session.
I am sure that hon. gentlemen opposite appreciate to—day, perhaps more even than
they did in the past, the great importance to Canada of carrying to a
successful issue the construction of this great railway. It is only fair to
say that, although some of these hon. gentlemen, at the inception of this proposition,
were disposed to combat the idea that the new
Transcontinental Railway was necessary, at the conclusion of the discussion of that
question, they frankly admitted that it was a good
thing to have the new railway. But they interjected into the discussion a proposition
which was utterly opposed to all the traditions of their
party, when they suggested the government ownership and
operation of that railway. Today, I am sure, they will join with us in the
satisfaction we all feel in learning that a great many of the
difficulties that were expected in the inauguration of this enterprise are rapidly
disappearing. Thus, we were
told that the country through which the railway is to pass
between Quebec and Winnipeg was a country of muskeg and stunted
poplar. I am
19
Mr. PARENT conflicts of opinion which its
discussion will set forth, the principles of toleration and equal rights
which should be sanctioned thereby.
It has been stated that 'Experience is a
physician called in too late' ; and I may not
be wrong in thinking that the experience
acquired of late years in the province of
Manitoba has been of that kind. The young
men of my generation, undoubtedly, have
not wholly realized the painful ordeal which
our country was made to undergo at a time
when the cry of race and religion prevented
the quiet discussion of the question of separate schools and of the use of the French
language. We were not in the heat of that
battle, wherein galling epithets and hateful
words were most dangerous missiles: we
did not smell the powder of that fanatical
warfare. But its rumblings reached our
ears; we heard its echo. It may be that
owing to our lack of experience, we have
taken a somewhat exaggerated view of the
situation; but we could not help trembling
at the sight of the turmoil into which that
bitter struggle of uncompromising principles
might have fled our country, made up of various elements, had not the present government
had the happy thought of negotiating
a truce which will be some day final peace,
let us hope. That result was effected, on
the one hand, through the advice given to
the Catholic minority from a quarter familiar to them, Rome, and, on the other hand,
through the gentle promptings of diplomacy,
whereby the Protestant majority were induced to take a stand making concessions
easier all the time.
The young men of my age are witnesses
to—day, as it were, of the aftermath only of
the storm; but that hurricane of prejudice
has left on its train enough ruins, it has
hurled too violently one against the others
the sons of beautiful France and those of
noble England, born on Canadian soil to
live side by side, it has caused too much
pain, brought about too many quarrels; in
a word, it has done too much harm to the
Canadian nation for us not to concern our
selves with its possible recurrence. 1 am
confident that the present government, in
constituting these new provinces of the Dominion, will foresee all the consequences
of
the setting in motion of the administrative
and legislative machinery which they intend
to install, and will thus prevent the crisis,
the terrible effects of which have been set
forth by recent events.
But if I consider from another standpoint
the conferring of provincial autonomy on the
Territories, I cannot but rejoice at the
thought of that fine page we are about to
add to the history of Canada.
The entrance of a new province into the
fold of the Dominion is always greeted with
a hearty welcome. If that great and beautiful Northwest has reached manhood, so
to speak, if it is mature for the grave func
tion of self government, let, in the first place,
all the other provinces offer their warmest
20
congratulations, and let the country as a
whole rejoice as well. For the birth of a
new province within the Dominion is not
merely an indication of our prosperity, is
not only a vindication of the manner in
which public affairs have been managed
since 1896. It is, besides, a step forward,
made by Canada, and above all it is the
certain pledge that our dream of becoming
a great nation will soon be carried out. The
gap which almost separates the extreme
west from the east of Canada is thereby
filled, our countly becomes almost homogeneous and one stride more is taken in our
countiy's noble and rapid progress towards
its great destiny.
Sir, if I may be allowed to express a hope,
let it be this: when self government will
have been conferred on western Canada,
self government which we love so much because it is akin to liberty, when the majority
of that countrv will be left to manage
its affairs, may they turn their eyes towards
the province, one of whose humble representatives I am here and whence so many
courageous missionaries have gone to these
distant lands; may they not close their eyes
to the examples of toleration and good will
which our legislators give in their dealings
with the minority; may the breezes from
our mountains when gently passing over the
wheat fields of Assiniboia and Alberta bring
with them their perfume of kindliness and
generosity.
If I feel at ease in thus greeting these provinces whose advent is announced in the
speech from the Throne, it is because I recall the measures taken beforehand by the
government on their behalf. The older provinces have extended a helping hand to that
younger sister and to ensure her growth and
normal development, the construction of a
gieat 1ailway is now ensured.
Now, Sir, it is not my intention to deal
at any length with the advantages offered
by the Grand Trunk Pacific scheme. All
that could be said on that subject has, or at
any rate. should have been said, and to
agree with me, one need only recall the innumerable speeches delivered in the course
of the recent electoral contest. If, nevertheless, I make a passing reference to this
gigantic undertaking, if I recall the dream
of general prosperity which its carrying out
will suggest for the country as a whole, if
I corroborate the gratitude of my western
brethren with my own humble congratulations, it is because I already can see the
heavy wheat trains steaming towards my
native city, crossing the river at Quebec,
over that marvellous bridge, whose construction was, in my childhood, so often represented
to me as impossible; and in the completion of that bridge I recognize the reward
due to the constant efforts, to the unrelenting unceasing labour of which I was the
|witness in my father's home. And should
such words seem presumptuous, please be
indulgent towards a son who is the witness
21 JANUARY 16, 1905
as well of attacks of all sorts directed
against his father. Â
Sir, unskilled as I am at dealing with
political problems, having only my good will
to offer for my country's service, I have not
the right to claim your attention any longer;
and as I must admit, I feel a certain fright
at the mere sound of my voice in this House,
1 long, as you will understand, to resume
my seat. My last thought, that which has
inspired me a courage which seemed to fail
me at times, and one which you will greet
most warmly, is, as you surmise, for the
man whom all here respect and admire, towards him who not only has won the esteem
and love of his fellow countrymen of all
parties, of all creeds, of all races, but who
has set his striking individuality in such
brilliant light, that from the banks of the
Thames and from those of the Seine, rays
of his glory are reflected on the Canadian
home land.
My last thought, which is one of gratitude,
goes to my representative, the right hon.
Prime Minister, at whose feet I lay the homage of the most enthusiastic love of the
Canadian youth. Of course, my testimony will
not have much weight when compared with
the almost unanimous acclamations which,
from the maritime provinces to British Columbia, have hailed his name, a name which
on the battle field was worth a flag. . My
testimony appears still more insignificant, if
we recall the anguish shown throughout the
country when, in the course of the last parliament, a terrible disease and out of
which
it was terribly sought to take advantage,
struck the idol of the Canadian people. And
lastly, my testimony would dwindle into
nothingness when compared with the feelings
of joy which harkened his return to health,
had it not to touch the heart of the greatest
amongst us, that feature of almost filial
feeling, independent of noisy manifestations,
that feature of inward reverence which
makes of my words the sincere, though imperfect echo of the very feelings of the
whole Canadian nation.
I second the motion.
Hon. G. E. FOSTER (North Toronto). Mr. Speaker, I think I
shall be entirely within my rights if I ask the kindly indulgence of the House usually
accorded to a new member on first rising to
address this august assembly. It is not often that it falls to the lot of
a new member to follow and in some degree to criticise the speeches of
the new members who ordinarily move and second the reply to the address. Such,
however, is my position to-day. In the first place, I congratulate very
heartily the hon. gentlemen who have moved and seconded the address, in
their maiden efforts in this House. The hon. gentleman who represents the
county of Pictou (Mr. Macdonald) displayed an admirable
confidence and a flow of words eloquent and copious, and his ideas,
if they do not altogether run current with mine, certainly
commended themselves to the atten
22tion of this House.
Unfortunately, I was not able to follow as closely the remarks made by
the hon. gentleman (Mr. Parent) who seconded the address, but if I have a
proper understanding, both of these speeches were exceedingly optimistic in
their trend and eulogistic in their purpose. The country
obtained a due share of the remarks, and attention of these hon. gentlemen and
my right hon. friend who leads the House (Sir W'ilfrid Laurier) was not
bereft of a becoming share, as well in their regards and their
attentions. In both these respects the country is pleased to have the
congratulations, my right hon. friend is pleased to have these renewed
expressions of fidelity, and we on this side of the House have no fault to find
with either. I, speaking for this side of the House, may at the outset
say that we heartily agree with the hon. gentlemen who have spoken, in
extending our warm congratulations to the distinguished gentleman who
is our new Governor General. We welcome him as we have welcomed all
Governors General to this Dominion of Canada. We welcome him especially
as one of a long line of ancestors who have done grand service for
the extension and government of this great empire to which we
all belong. and I do not think even in this age with all the rights and privileges
of self-government, that the over-seas dominions have
and possess, and intend to maintain, that the field is at all closed for
the exertion of similar influences, not of extension or of conquest,
but of organization of development and the knitting together of all parts
of the empire. Who does not know that the Canada of today exercises a
very large influence on the policies and the tendencies of government in the
British empire? Though no expression of opinion may be made
in this House, though no expression of opinion may be officially tendered
in anyway, yet there is the attentive heed paid to what are the
tendencies and thoughts and wishes of the great dependencies
beyond the seas, which have their influence in determining policies and
in determining the trend and action of the British government itself. Is it not
equally true that distinguished men, members of the empire, coming from
the mother islands to the dependencies and over-seas dominions such as
this, have also a very strong part to play and to fulfil in so knitting
together, in so carrymg out the idea of co-operation of sentiment and of
effort, that this great, but yet to a large extent, unorganized world-wide
empire may become more firmly and securely united than it is at the
present time? So that our Governor General, welcomed here for himself and
for his ancestry, is welcomed here also by us for the work which
he has to do, and which we will welcome and co-operate with him in doing.
In reference to the speeches, we may say that the statements which have been
made by the two hon. gentlemen who have moved and seconded the address,
could be characterized
31
COMMONS
Mr. FOSTER the majority of my right hon.
friend ? And is be proud of a majority swelled by appeals of this kind ?
And here is another extract :
(Translation)
TO THE ELECTORS OF THE COUNTY OF
MONTMAGNY.
The  Courrier de Montmagny,' October 31,
Up to now I have been the Liberal candidate.
Was not that glory enough for one man
to be the Liberal candidate ? It appears
not.
(Translation)
To-day, at the request of a large number of
Conservatives, I become the nationalist candidate. that is to say, I take the field
as the
champion of French and Catholic Canada, and
of its right to a fair representation at Ottawa.
I am a Liberal, but before all, I am against
imperialism, militarism and against Quebec
being crushed under the heel of the Tories.
They will try to buy your votes, my friends,
but think of your old flag, think of our dear
province, remember our ancestors and our religion. The motto of Quebec is:
' I remember '
Do ye remember! .
ARMAND LAVERGNE.
Now, I leave that as a side thought for my
hon. friend, and I ask him does he approve
of that method of canvass, and does he think
that is one of the filings that will bind this
country together, will promote high public
political ideas '2 Taking all these things into
consideration, there are some points, which
serve, may be, to diminish the apparent value
of the great victory of the third of November.
But, I have been too long upon these
details, and I now wish to come to the
speech. The speech from the Throne itself
—well there is not much to come to in this
speech. It seems to have sprung from barren and unfruitful soil. It looks to me like
either the product of utter exhaustion—due,
1 suppose, to the great eflorts of the election
--or the product of a proud and superior
carelessness, as though the hon. gentlemen
opposite had earned a holiday and a good
time, without thinking very much about the
country. But there is one thing in the speech
and that is the autonomy of the Northwest.
We are not permitted to know what this
measure will be. But it is a measure that
has long been asked for by the people of
the. Northwest, a measure that has been supported by His Majesty's loyal opposition
in
the late parliament, as it is in this House,
but which has been consistently and persistently denied by my right Ihon. friend and
the government which he leads. in this
speech, we have a promise of autonomy
for the Northwest. Was that a late preelection repentance? Was the letter that my
right hon. friend Wrote on the eve of the
election promising that something should be
done to this end wrung from him by the fear
of antagonizing votes? Whatever the reason,
there was a promise, and this time there is
the fulfilment so far as the speech from the
 Â
32
Throne goes. I hope that my right hon.
friend, in bringing down this measure, will
give to the new province a geographical
area that will be sufficient. For myself, I
am opposed to dividing this country up into
small provinces with their burden of judical
and administrative oflicers, duties and expenses. I hope also there will be no stinginess
with reference to the resources with
which the new province shall be endowed.
I think it would be a mistake if it were left
to come to this parliament year after year
voicing its demands for means to meet what
must be great expenses, and increasing expenses as the development of the province
proceeds. I hope the powers to be given to
that province will be so definite, so clear and
so full that the measure will be satisfactory
to the sturdy pioneers who are to make
that province great, and will avoid grievances and recriminations of every sort. We
have no jealousy of the great west. There
is no rivalry between the west and the
east. The east bought the patrimony of that
country, the money of the east paid for it.
The brawn and brain of the east pioneered
that great country and to-day our sons, our
brothers and our fathers are the dominant
race of the province that is to be. Every
power which can be given to them should
be given to enable them to lay the foundations of a province with an almost illimitable
future and one that will justify the
confidence which we had in it when we made
it a part of this great Dominion, a confidence
which every succeeding year has increased.
There is a further mild allusion made-
no, there is no allusion made to that Old-
time indispensable market to the south of
us. What has happened hon. gentlemen
opposite? Have they discarded some more
of their theories ? I know that it is impossible for heated steel always to retain
its
initial heat, but one would never have
thought that that ardent party which called
for commercial union, which vociferated its
demands for unrestricted reciprocity, which
reiterated its adhesion to the idea that the
market to the south of us and its reciprocal
enjoyment was worth more to us than the
markets of all the world besides, should
have lost all its intrinsic heat and warmth.
Yet to-day the only paragraph we have in
the speech that touches the country to the
south of us, is that somewhat obscure one in
which it is stated that an International
Commission composed of three representatives from each country will be appointed
To investigate and report upon the conditions
and uses of the waters adjacent to the boundary line between the United States and
Canada.
What that may mean I do not know, but We will have to possess ourselves in
patience until we find out the meaning of the clause. But
for ever and for ever, it would seem, the old flag Which was nailed to the
top of the mast by my hon. friend, and of which he said that it would
float there un
39
Sir. WILFRID LAUTIER the eyes of my hon.
friend would be a merit in the eyes of every one; it has the merit of
being concise and to the point. I believe my hon. friend rather rejoices in high
and loud redundant sentences, and that the mere clatter of syllables has
some charm for his ears, especially when the syllables fall from his own
tongue. I remember a time when the speech was not so concise. In the olden
days, it was rather prone to conceal the paucity of material under a
verbosity of expression. My hon. friend (Mr. Foster) should have realized
that the people will not be fed upon words and wind, but prefer a bill of
fare reduced to a single course if there is some substance in it. There is not
much legislation in the speech because we do not propose to introduce much
legislation. There is only one great measure which it is proposed to
introduce and that is a Bill granting autonomy to the western territories.
We think the time has come when the western territories should
have full partnership in confederation, when we should admit
them as members of the Canadian family as full provinces. My hon. friend
alluded to the fact that for two or three years there has been an appeal
from the territories for full autonomy. Some two years ago we received
delegations and requests from the legislature and in some instances from the
people also, to have the territories at once admitted as full provinces,
but we represented to the people and to the legislature that the
time was scarcely opportune to have this introduced, that we could not be very
far from a general election and that at that time the representation of the
territories in this House was small while after a general
election there would be a larger representation. They had only four
members in the last parliament, they have now ten and I think the wisdom of
our judgment has now been justified. It is true that we found some doubting
Thomases in the territories who thought that we would not implement our
promises, but there is to-day in the speech from the Throne an indication
and the certainty that on this occasion as on every occasion this government fulfils
its pledges and carries out its promises. My
hon friend (Mr. Foster) does not know the character of the legislation
which we are about to introduce. I am sure my hon. friend does not
expect that we shall tell him at this time the principal features of the
Bill. We are working on it now ; it is far advanced, but in respect to
three or four salient features we thought it better to wait for the representations
of the Northwest government and also the advice of our
friends on the floor of this House.
There is another suggestion in the speech
upon which my hon. friend requires some
information. He has not fully apprehended
what is meant by our statement with regard
to the commission which we have appointed
to deal with the waterways between the
United States and Canada. I am very glad
40
to give my hon. friend and the House the information to which they are entitled on
this
point. It is within the knowledge of everybody that along a very great part of the
boundary between Canada and the United
States is the water system of the St. Lawrence. Now, I am sure. that every one will
admit that it is to the interest of Canada as
well as the United States that the surface of
the water should be kept at as high a level as
possible. Some few years ago, when it was
rumoured that the state of Illinois intended
to connect the waters of Lake Michigan
with the waters of the Mississippi river by
means of a canal, there was an apprehension expressed, not only in this country but
in the United States, that that work might
have the effect of lowering the level of. the
waters of Lake Michigan and adjacent
waters'. As the event turned out, this fear
was groundless, as the volume of water
taken away by the canal is not sufficient to
materially affect the level of the lakes. But
if similar works were to be undertaken
right and left, if the waters of Lake Erie
and our system of waterways generally
were to be tapped at different points, it is
possible that the volume of water removed
from the lakes would be so great that the
level might be appreciably lowered. That
is not all. In sections of the country where
the boundary is not water, but land, there
are streams and large rivers which have
their sources in one country and which flow
into the other. Complaint has been made
by the United States that Canadians have
constructed some works upon rivers which
have their sources in Canada and which
flow into the United States, and that these
works affect the flow of the waters in their
country. We also have made complaints
to the United States that Americans have
constructed upon some rivers, the St. John
river, for instance, works which affect the
flow of the waters in our country. It is,
therefore, to the mutual interest and advantage of both countries to have this question
properly investigated with the view of having concurrent legislation if such should
be
found necessary. From olden times it has
been a principle of Roman law, which has
been adopted by most civilized nations, that
the riparian owner of any stream has the
right to use the water of that stream for
his own benefit, provided he does not impair the flow of the water beyond the boundary
of his property. This is a principle
of law which dominates in almost every
country; but it is not possible to have this
principle followed and carried out when
the works are in one country and the boundary of the property is in another country.
For these reasons we have thought it advisable to respond to the invitation of the
United States to have this question investigated. We have agreed to a commission
to be composed of six members, three to
represent the government of the United
41 JANUARY 16, 1905
States and three to represent the government of Canada. The instructions to the
commission shall be laid on the table at
an early day ; but in the meantime, to give
all the information to my hon. friend to
which he is entitled, I may mention the
names of the commissioners who are to represent the government of Canada—Mr.
Maybee, K.C., an eminent lawyer of the
city of Toronto; Mr. Louis Coste, of the
Department of Public Works, an eminent
hydraulic engineer, and Mr. King, the chief
geographer of the Department of the Interior. These gentlemen are to represent
Canada at the conference, and we have reason to hope that they will bring in a report
which will be satisfactory. I may say that
this commission has no power to decide
anything. It is not to lay down the basis
of a treaty. It is simply to study the conditions and to report whether it is possible
to devise remedies to meet an existing evil.
My hon. friend has entered into a discussion of questions which I do not think it
advisable for me to discuss at this moment.
He has referred, for instance, to the defence of the country. This is a matter
which may engage discussion later on,
when my hon. friend the Minister of Militia and Defence is in his seat. As to the
question of the tariff and the question of the
Audit Act, I can only say to my hon. friend
that at this moment I do not propose to dis
cuss these questions. They will be dealt
with fully, and to his satisfaction, I hopethough perhaps this is too much to expectwhen
the Minister of Finance is in his seat.
Unfortunately, he has been obliged to go
to Europe for domestic reasons.
I may say, Mr. Speaker, that we do not
propose this session to have any very ser
ious or important legislation beyond the Act
with reference to the Northwest Territories. I agree to everything that has been
said by my hon. friend as to the importance of that measure, though I would not
subscribe to all his contentions. We propose, if possible, to have a short session.
We have not been blessed with a short session for a long time. We have had a session
of seven months and another session of
five months; but I think, if my hon. friend
will make a bargain with me, to make an
effort to stop the flow of eloquence
on both sides of the House, to keep within
bounds, we may hope to see summer in
the country, or spring by the time the sugar
flows.
Mr. FOSTER. I will go to the sugaring- up with
you.
Sir WILFRID LAURIER. We meet at this time under a
combination of happy auspices. We have not only a new parliament, but a new Governor
General. It has become a trite observation that
Canada has been exceptionally fortunate in the character of
those who have been entrusted with the high prerogative of representing the
42 Crown in this the first of all the British dominions beyond the
seas. Our present Governor General has been received with perhaps more favour than
any of his predecessors, and
there is cause for this. His Excellency has the good fortune to bear
a name dear to all the friends of liberty and constitutional
government in every part of the empire, and especially in Canada. The illustrious
name of Grey recalls the name of the great man whose
persistent energy wrung from unwilling peers and a reluctant king the
measure of reform which changed the face of England, which averted a revolution,
and which transferred the government from a
class to the nation. The name of Grey also recalls to the people of this
country the illustrious names of Durham and Elgin—the name of the man whose
bold genius conceived and designed the policy which has revolutionized
the colonial system of England by transferring the government of Canada from the hands
of a grasping oligarchy
to the people themselves; and the name of the man whose strong courage
carried that policy to a successful issue. Therefore, I say we meet under a
combination of happy circumstances, and there is reason to hope and
expect that the illustrious name of Grey will be associated with still
further blessings to the people of Canada.
Mr. W. F. MACLEAN (South York). Mr. Speaker, it is not my
intention to continue the line of banter which has more or less
characterized the preceding speeches. I intend just for a few moments
to ask the attention of the House to some incidents of the
recent election in this country. If there is one thing that may be taken as a
lesson to us from that election, it is thisthat in it there
disappeared, especially in my own province of Ontario-a province which I
am glad to say did not send a majority in favour of the present
government, as was stated by the hon. member for Pictou (Mr.
Macdonald)—a number of gentlemen who forgot why they had been sent
to parliament. They had forgotten what representative institutions in
this country mean. They had forgotten that they were sent here to
represent the people. They thought they were sent here to represent the
interests of great corporations, and their constituents found them out, and
they have disappeared from the public life of this country. Â
Without presuming to give any advice to
the new men in this House, I would say to
them, no matter on what side they may be,
that more and more is it becoming incumbent on the representatives of the people to
give some concern to the interests of the
people rather than the interests of corporations. Only the other day I met a very
worthy friend of mine who occupied a seat
in this House in the last parliament, who
came from Ontario, and supported hon. gen
45
JANUARY 16, 1905
Ontario. There are a hundred ways of
putting an end to monopolies if we have
men enough in office willing to do it, but.
neither the government nor the Liberal
party are prepared to do anything. Neither
will take the requisite steps to secure to the
people travelling between Montreal and
Toronto the two-cent rate to which they are
entitled. These monopolies are the curse
of parliament and the country. From time
to time we have the doctrine laid down that
parliament ought not to interfere. But I
contend that it is the duty of parliament to
regulate every one of these corporations,
and give a warning to any corporation which
is not treating the public fairly, that it must
mend its ways or we will wipe it out of
existence. Instead, however, of giving these
corporations a warning, we give them additional concessions every time they ask for
them, and the public are told to go into the
courts and recover their rights if they can,
but that they need expect no assistance
from the Minister of Justice or the Minister
of Railways.
There is another point to which attention
has been called of late, and which is well
worthy of attention, and that is that in the
United States, whose institutions we sometimes think but little of, they have what
is
known as the grand jury, which is possessed of powers of inquiry at important
stages. In this country it was left to a
private citizen to investigate the shameful
ballot-box frauds that were attempted in
the recent election. We were told that the
Minister of Justice was active in the matter
but still it was left to a private citizen to
expose the crime that had been attempted.
Had we had a grand jury system as in the
United States, the Crown Attorney could
have issued a warrant and an investigation
could have been held. And the same with
other scandals in the recent election. But,
as things are. there is no promise of an investigation there is no likelihood of the
air being cleared through the action of any
one identified with the government.
Returning for a moment to the position
of railway corporations and their influence,
we find that the greatest evil prevailing in
the United States today in connection with
railroading is the granting of discriminating
rates in favour of certain corporations.
There are great trusts in the United States,
and these have been built up by railroad
discriminations. The people of the United
States are trying in some way to stop these
discriminations. The plan that they have
adopted is that of establishing a court such
as our Railway Commission. But this plan
has not succeeded. The president has been
forced to take up the question. But the public there see more and more clearly that
the
only substantial cure is in government ownership of the railways. And that, I believe,
is equally true of this country. It is true
that hon. gentlemen opposite say they do
not believe in government ownership. But
46
government ownership is the new principle
of this century of which the right hon.
Prime Minister professes to be the exponent.
He has not read aright the sentiment of the
country if he thinks that government ownership is not the only cure of the grievances
arising from the operation of railways in
this country and in the United States. But,
instead of proposing government ownership,
the right hon. gentleman leaves us in doubt.
As the hon, member for North Toronto (Mr.
Foster) has pointed out, we are entitled to
an explanation in regard to our state-owned
railway, the Intercolonial. Is the rumour
true that that railway is to be given over
to the Grand Trunk ? We know that it is
true that when the opportunity presented
itself recently to couple up the Canada
Atlantic with our state-owned road, the government failed to improve that opportunity,
thereby injuring the interests of the people
and of the people's railway. The government had the opportunity of strengthening
the Intercolonial, but apparently their policy
is to let that road run down and turn it
over to the Grand Trunk Pacific. Such a
policy is not in line, I believe, with the
demand of the times. The people see that
there is no cure for the transportation problems of this country except in government
ownership. And if gentlemen opposite think
they have a mandate from the people to
destroy government ownership, I venture to
tell them that they are mistaken. There
is a party in this country, a national, a
growing party, a party favoured by the
young men of Canada, which holds that the
best thing that could happen to this country
would be the nationalization of the Grand
Trunk Pacific. And the agitation to nationalize that railway at an early stage of
its
career will go on. The carrying out of that
policy will give hope of relief to the people,
and especially to the people of Ontario and
Quebec. The grievances of these people
against the Grand Trunk today are worse
than ever they were. The grievances of
Toronto and Montreal, the grievances of the
manufacturers and the shippers and otther
people who live along that line are constantly increasing, and the feeling of these
people
is that state-ownership of that great railway
is the only cure for those grievances.
Reference has been made to the promise
of increased autonomy to the Northwest.
It is high time that this idea should be carried out. I hope that the measure will
be
a wide one, and one that will allow for the
growth and development of that country.
But when we speak of increased autonomy
for the Northwest, I think there is something
to be said of the need of greater autonomy
for the Dominion. The time has come
when the bounds of our powers as a country
should be widened. I am not afraid of the
future and of the problems it will present
for solution. I am not afraid to say that
Canada should be more autonomous than
she is to-day. I am not afraid to say that [...]
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