Colonial Despatches
The colonial despatches of Vancouver Island and British Columbia 1846-1871
Public Offices document
Laurie, Simon Somerville to Monsell, William 21 September 1869, CO 60:37, no. 10660, 295.
Abstract
Laurie, Simon Somerville to Monsell, William 21 September 1869, CO 60:37, no. 10660, 295.
Public Offices document.
Minutes (3), Other documents (2).
Laurie to Under-Secretary of State
Colonial Committee of the
Church of Scotland
22 Queen St. Edinburgh
21 September 1869
Church of Scotland
22 Queen St. Edinburgh
Sir,
I have the honour on behalf of the above Committee to submit the
following reply to your letter of the 31st May with enclosure
from the Governor of British Columbia.
1. As it appears from the Attorney General's Report to the
Governor that the existing Law of the Colony is
now sufficient for the purposes of the Promoters of the "Ordinance
to incorporate the Members" of St. Andrew's Church, and as there
is a prima facie inexpediency in granting to various religious
bodies separate legislative incorporation, the Committee are not
prepared at present to support the application for the enactment
of the ordinance. They must wait for further information as to
the special grounds for urging it.
2. At the same time while waiting for fuller information, the
Committee must respectfully protest against the doctrine on
which the argument of the Attorney General for theColony
Colony of
British Columbia seems to be in large measure founded. If for
general or special reasons of local importance it be considered
expedient that the ordinance in question should be passed, no
objection can be taken to it on Constitutional grounds. The
Church of Scotland is a part of the Constitution of the United
Kingdom and is necessarily recognized as such by the Crown at
home and abroad. (See 5 Anne cap. 8 Art. 25 of the Treaty of
Union and relative Act of the Scottish Parliament 1690 cap. 5.)
Colony of
British Columbia seems to be in large measure founded. If for
general or special reasons of local importance it be considered
expedient that the ordinance in question should be passed, no
objection can be taken to it on Constitutional grounds. The
Church of Scotland is a part of the Constitution of the United
Kingdom and is necessarily recognized as such by the Crown at
home and abroad. (See 5 Anne cap. 8 Art. 25 of the Treaty of
Union and relative Act of the Scottish Parliament 1690 cap. 5.)
On this point the Attorney General seems to be under some
misapprehension.
Minutes by CO staff
Sir F. Rogers
I gather from this letter that the Colonial Committee of the Church of Scotland view with disfavour the proposed Ordinance.
I gather from this letter that the Colonial Committee of the Church of Scotland view with disfavour the proposed Ordinance.
Probably, therefore, without some further explanation of the
special objects which this congregation has in view, Lord
Granville wd hardly be prepared to instruct the Governor to
assent to the proposed measure.
Send a copy of this report to the Governor & write as above
suggested.
I have no very strong opinion against the incorporation—though
I think this Ordinance should be reconsidered—but I still am
disposed to think that it is not desirable that every
congregation or religious body should be incorporated.
The incorporation of the congregation of a Church is certainly
unusual, if not unprecedented, and as all the objects (so far as
I know) of the members of the congregation can be attained
without incorporation, the onus is upon those who advocate the
change to show the special advantages of it.
I certainly doubt the expediency of allowing such a section as
the 7th by which rules of the corporation are put on the same
footing as a local ordinance.
HTH
23.9.69
I do not know on what ground the Committee state "that there is
prima facie
inexpediency in granting to various Religious bodies separate
Legislative Incorporation." I should have stated positively the
direct contrary—that whenever there was practical succession, it was
prima facie
expedient to give that succession the most convenient
possible legal shape.
In the paper of [GH?]
I believe every constituted society is
ipso facto a corporation, capable of acting thro' some officer.
And I fancy that the system works well. On this point vide
minutes on 5567.
I think generally we shall get into a scrape, if, in a Colony
not practically Crown, we intervene betn
the central body
of the Scotch Church & its outlying dependencies—not receiving
Govt pay.
However in the present case the authority of the Col. Committee
is recognized by the promoters of the Ordce—so that we are
safe in acting on their authority—within limits.
I wd write that observing that the promoters of this Ordinance
recognized the jurisdiction of the Colonial Committee of the
Church of Scotland, Ld G. had referred it to that body for any
observations they mt wish to make upon it. That it
appeared that the Colonial Committee declined to urge its
adoption, & that, this being the case, Ld G. considered that,
independently of objections of detail raised by the A.G.,
the
promoters of the bill wd themselves desire that it not be
passed—that Ld G. therefore directed the Govr to withold his
assent from it.
the
promoters of the bill wd themselves desire that it not be
passed—that Ld G. therefore directed the Govr to withold his
assent from it.
Other documents included in the file
Rogers to Secretary to Colonial Committee, Church of
Scotland, 6 October 1869, forwarding copy of despatch to the
governor on the subject for information.
