Colonial Despatches
The colonial despatches of Vancouver Island and British Columbia 1846-1871
Despatch to London
Seymour, Frederick to Grenville, Richard 30 November 1868, CO 60:33, no. 539, 525.
Abstract
Despatch to London.
Minutes (6), Enclosures (untranscribed) (4), Other documents (3), Marginalia (1).
Seymour lays before Buckingham an address from
a Convention held at Yaleand encloses two notices protesting against the address from the Yale Convention. Seymour summarizes the points of the address and provides comments regarding each point, containing discussions of confederation with Canada, responsible government in British Columbia,
Retrenchment,and
A reciprocal commercial treaty with the United States.Minutes by Cox and Rogers discuss how the Colonial Office should respond to the address Seymour presented in his despatch concerning the topics of confederation, responsible government, retrenchment, and trade reciprocity with the US. Cox’s minute suggests sending the despatch to Young, and Rogers’s minute suggests forwarding the minute to Sandford and the Foreign Office. Blake’s minute suggests seeing
subsequent 26/2638 March 4, 1869.Included documents describe the concerns of the Yale Convention attendees and of individuals who disagree with the convention attendees.
No. 125
Victoria
30th November 1868
My Lord Duke,
I have the honor to lay before Your Grace a letter addressed to
me by the principal leaders of a large and respectablePublic
Public
meeting, or as these Gentlemen prefer to style it, a Convention
held at Yale. I add a copy of my reply.
Public
meeting, or as these Gentlemen prefer to style it, a Convention
held at Yale. I add a copy of my reply.
2. The principal questions upon which the convention agreed
appears
to have been:
1. Union or Confederation with the Dominion of Canada.
2. Representative Institutions and Responsible Government in
the Colony.
3. Retrenchment in thePublic
Public expenditure, principally in the
way of dismissing certain public officers and reducing the
Salaries of others.
Public expenditure, principally in the
way of dismissing certain public officers and reducing the
Salaries of others.
4. A reciprocal commercial treaty with the United States
whereby the raw productions of the Colony might be introduced
into the neighboring Republic duty free.
3. As regards the first point I do not suppose thatthere
there is an
Englishman who would not desire to see one unbroken Dominion
under his flag extending from the Atlantic to the Pacific. For
all present facilities of intercourse we are as near to Japan as
to Ottawa. But the matter does not rest with the so called
Convention at Yale, but has already occupied Your Grace's
attention and that of the Government of Canada.I
I must say that
this Colony appears to possess so little interest for the people
of England that perhaps any change which would call attention to
its really wonderful resources would do good.
there is an
Englishman who would not desire to see one unbroken Dominion
under his flag extending from the Atlantic to the Pacific. For
all present facilities of intercourse we are as near to Japan as
to Ottawa. But the matter does not rest with the so called
Convention at Yale, but has already occupied Your Grace's
attention and that of the Government of Canada.I
I must say that
this Colony appears to possess so little interest for the people
of England that perhaps any change which would call attention to
its really wonderful resources would do good.
4. The second resolution is in favour of representative
Institutions and responsible Government in the Colony. The
Legislative Constitution of the Colony is a subjectwhich
which has
occupied my attention much of late, but I have not been able to
see a clear path before me. Local politics have their Head
Quarters in Victoria. If one ascends the Fraser but a few miles
one finds less excitement and better tempers at New Westminster
and so it goes on in proceeding up Country till at Clinton the
whole thing is ignored. The miners of Cariboo andKootenay
Kootenay are
in the most profound state of indifference as regards what is
passing at Head Quarters. I should be glad if we had some mode
of allowing the people of Victoria through their representatives
to relieve themselves of their burden of complaints and by
simply stating what the "miserable misgovernment" (with which
cry the streets echo) consists of, enable a respectfulexplanation
explanation to be furnished. I shall anxiously consider this
subject and it is not unlikely that it will be brought up at the
next Session of the Legislature.
which has
occupied my attention much of late, but I have not been able to
see a clear path before me. Local politics have their Head
Quarters in Victoria. If one ascends the Fraser but a few miles
one finds less excitement and better tempers at New Westminster
and so it goes on in proceeding up Country till at Clinton the
whole thing is ignored. The miners of Cariboo andKootenay
Kootenay are
in the most profound state of indifference as regards what is
passing at Head Quarters. I should be glad if we had some mode
of allowing the people of Victoria through their representatives
to relieve themselves of their burden of complaints and by
simply stating what the "miserable misgovernment" (with which
cry the streets echo) consists of, enable a respectfulexplanation
explanation to be furnished. I shall anxiously consider this
subject and it is not unlikely that it will be brought up at the
next Session of the Legislature.
5. The Convention then urges retrenchment. We have an enormous
amount to pay for interest on Loans. Nearly a third of our
Revenue. Were we free from debts, our finances would be in a
most flourishing condition.I
I am not answerable for the debt.
It was not incurred by me, yet it devolves upon me to pay and I
believe that the doing so, is the principal cause of the outcry
of "miserable misgovernment." Reductions in Salaries to the
extent of upwards of $80,000 have been made during my tenure of
Office. I have never appointed anyone higher than a Constable
and have no hope of doing so during my incumbencyof
of Office. I
think my own Salary a little high for the Colony to pay but
certainly not so for the holder of the very important and
expensive position I fill to receive. Sir James Douglas in
October 1858 (when the revenue had not amounted to £22,900)
reported to the Secretary of State that he could not live under
£5,000 a year.
I am not answerable for the debt.
It was not incurred by me, yet it devolves upon me to pay and I
believe that the doing so, is the principal cause of the outcry
of "miserable misgovernment." Reductions in Salaries to the
extent of upwards of $80,000 have been made during my tenure of
Office. I have never appointed anyone higher than a Constable
and have no hope of doing so during my incumbencyof
of Office. I
think my own Salary a little high for the Colony to pay but
certainly not so for the holder of the very important and
expensive position I fill to receive. Sir James Douglas in
October 1858 (when the revenue had not amounted to £22,900)
reported to the Secretary of State that he could not live under
£5,000 a year.
6. As regards a treaty of Commercial reciprocity I agree
entirely with the Convention.Our
Our nearest markets for lumber
now are Australia and France and at this moment when San
Francisco has been half ruined by an Earthquake and it is
proposed to rebuild the shaken houses of timber instead of Stone,
the citizens will have to depend upon the Mills of Washington
Territory for their supplies, instead of being able to make use
of the magnificent timber of Burrard Inlet. A fewmiles
miles from
the boundary but unfortunately for the mill owners on English soil.
Our nearest markets for lumber
now are Australia and France and at this moment when San
Francisco has been half ruined by an Earthquake and it is
proposed to rebuild the shaken houses of timber instead of Stone,
the citizens will have to depend upon the Mills of Washington
Territory for their supplies, instead of being able to make use
of the magnificent timber of Burrard Inlet. A fewmiles
miles from
the boundary but unfortunately for the mill owners on English soil.
7. It is but right that I should state that the proceedings of
the Yale Meeting did not meet with universal approval. I
enclose two notices, very respectably signed, protesting against
the whole affair.
8. I may add that the more prominent advocates for
Confederation weredefeated
defeated at the last elections in Victoria
for members to serve in the Legislative Council.
defeated at the last elections in Victoria
for members to serve in the Legislative Council.
Minutes by CO staff
Sir F. Rogers
Governor Seymour sends home the result of a "Convention of Delegates" held at Yale in Sept. called together by the Confederation League to accelerate the admission of B. Columbia into the Dominion of Canada.
Governor Seymour sends home the result of a "Convention of Delegates" held at Yale in Sept. called together by the Confederation League to accelerate the admission of B. Columbia into the Dominion of Canada.
The 4 topics to which the Resolutions refer are:
1. Confederation
2. Responsible Govt
3. Retrenchment
4. Trade reciprocity with the U. States.
1. Confederation
2. Responsible Govt
3. Retrenchment
4. Trade reciprocity with the U. States.
1.
Confederation.
It has already been the subject of correspondence, & I would
refer you to your minuteon
on 10906/67 (with 538)
"it seems to me quite impossible to think of this question till
the H.B.Cos Territory is in possession of Canada—nor until
the two Colonies B. Columbia & Canada have so extended
themselves as to warrant Expenditure in roads &c." The
originators of the Resolutions appear quite able to take care of
themselves in these terms—see Resol: 3 page 4.
on 10906/67 (with 538)
"it seems to me quite impossible to think of this question till
the H.B.Cos Territory is in possession of Canada—nor until
the two Colonies B. Columbia & Canada have so extended
themselves as to warrant Expenditure in roads &c." The
originators of the Resolutions appear quite able to take care of
themselves in these terms—see Resol: 3 page 4.
2. Responsible Govt. See your minute on 6951.
One Chamber called the Legislative Assembly. Executive Council
holding office while commanding confidence of Assembly—nominative
Council unsuited—people no Constitutional power &c.
3. Retrenchment. Reduction of Salaries from the Govr
downwards & amalgamation of Offices.
4. Reciprocity.
In 538 the Govr reports that the question will shortly come
before the Legislative Council. The question has already been
mooted by the H.B.Co & Mr Sproat & others—see papers with 538.
From Resolution 37 it appears there is to be an Address to the
Queen, to the Govt of Canada & Petitions to the two Houses of
Parliament.
The Govr also sends two notices "respectably signed"
protesting agst the Resolutions.
It remains to be seen what line the new Council take.
A copy of the dispatch, not the printed Resolutions, should be
sent I suppose to Sir John Young.
And it is matter for consideration whether Lord Granville is
prepared
to give Govr Seymour any guide as to Responsible
Govt or Representative Institutions—in regard to which
Govr Seymour says he has "not yet been able to see a clear
path before him."
to give Govr Seymour any guide as to Responsible
Govt or Representative Institutions—in regard to which
Govr Seymour says he has "not yet been able to see a clear
path before him."
The last Council consisted of 5 officials, 9 members nominated
by the Govr & 9 appointed by the Govr on the "recommendation of
the People".
CC
17/1
I. It seems to me questionable whether V.C.I. can be
conveniently governed from Ottawa. But if the parties concerned
think it can, it is certainly not for the British Govt (I
shd say) to stand in their way. Our policy, I should say,
was to assist everything wh tends to make Union practicable,
but to discourage that premature & impatient action wh
defeats its own object so far as we can witht appearing to
resist that wh (I presume) we really wish to see effected.
The present state of the negotiations with the HBC wh renders
it for the moment absurd to talk of Union betn Canada & B.C.
is both a real & a producible reason for not entertaining
the question now. And I wd so use it.
II. As to representative institutions & responsible
Govt the objections are
1. that formally represve institutions did not answer very
well in V.C. Island.
2. that they will almost certainly hasten the course of
Anglo-Saxon violence ending in destruction of aborigines. For
the purpose of keeping the peace in this respect the American
character of the population renders the maintenance of an
Executive responsible to an external authority peculiarly necessary.
3. There is great practical difficulty in either providing for
the representation of aliens & miners (who form a large part of
the population) or in leaving them unrepresented. A mining
district is crowded one year & deserted the next.
4. There is practical representation already.
Public
meetings recommend to the Govr certain Members of the
Council & the Govr thereupon nominates.
Public
meetings recommend to the Govr certain Members of the
Council & the Govr thereupon nominates.
5. The establishment of Respe Govt (at any rate) will not
tend towards Confederation.
6. And if Confederation is to be our end it is hardly worth
while setting up fresh institutions to be merely transitional.
7. That the most extraordinary catastrophes may be expected if
the Fenians of B.C. in their present state of disorder are
handed over to such a Govt or succession of Govts as
wd arise out of such a Legislature as wd first emerge on
giving to B.C. such representative
institutions as the present
composition of its population renders possible.
institutions as the present
composition of its population renders possible.
In short I submit, that this Colony is not in a state to be
relieved from a certain steadying external pressure—& I do
not like to relieve it from the pressure of Downing Street till
we can substitute the pressure of Ottawa. At any rate not till
it has recovered its balance after the shock of
Amalgamation—wh has been considerable.
III. The memorialists go into detail on the subject of
financial Reform & this paper shd therefore be seen by Sir F.
Sandford.
IV. On reciprocity the F.O. will be consulted.
If these
Gentlemen were of more unquestionable importance, it mt
possibly be desirable to answer them by more or less of a manifesto.
If these
Gentlemen were of more unquestionable importance, it mt
possibly be desirable to answer them by more or less of a manifesto.
Stating the disposition of HMG with regard to Confederation &
Repe Instns (if not Responsible Govt) that
disposition not being eventually hostile—but expectant.
Also some general language respecting financial reform &
economy—also, (when we hear from the F.O.) notice of their
desire for a Reciprocity Treaty.
But there is so much probability that the "Convention" is mere
empty blast—that (the address being to the Governor not to
the Queen)—I shd be rather inclined merely to acknowledge
the dph "enclosing an address (describing it) from certain
delegates and also enclosing what appear to be certain
advertisements signed by persons in Victoria who declare that
these delgates have not in any way received authority to
represent their opinions or desires."
FR
19/1
Documents enclosed with the main document (not transcribed)
Memorial, Robert Wallace, Amor De Cosmos and others to Seymour,
9 October 1868, submitting resolutions of the convention
as per despatch.
Printed minutes and resolutions of the Yale Convention (seven
pages).
Newspaper clippings,
Daily British Colonist, 22 and 23 September 1868, containing
names of persons disapproving of the convention.
Other documents included in the file
Sandford to Under-Secretary of State, Foreign Office, 4 February
1869, forwarding extract of the
despatch relating to the reciprocity treaty for consideration.
